Kate Doster, email marketing specialist, share how to sell anything with this email sequence. You’ll want to have notebook handy.
Kate breaks down how to lead your potential customer on a journey as you speak to their needs, share the benefits of your product, talk to your potential customers’ objections, answer their frequently asked questions, and ultimately get the sale.
In this episode Kate talks about:
- Why email performs better than social media for sales
- Why we value what we pay for
- Why moms struggle with selling
- Why we want to mirror our customers’ lives back to them in what we write
- Why you want to offer money back guarantees
- And so much more!!
If you are looking for an email sales sequence that converts, this is it! Copy this sequence!
Table of Contents
- Digital Product WORKSHOP REPLAY – How to Turn on a New Income Stream
- MiloTree Pop-Up App
- Kate Doster
- Kate Doster’s 2 Years of Emails
- Join Jillian’s Newsletter
- Become a Blogger Genius Facebook Group
- All Blogger Genius Podcast Episodes
Subscribe to the Blogger Genius Podcast
Welcome to the Blogger Genius Podcast brought to you by MiloTree. Here’s your host, Jillian Leslie.
Jillian Leslie 0:11
Hello, my friends. Welcome back to the Blogger Genius Podcast. I am your host, Jillian Leslie. I have been building blogs and businesses online since 2009 when David, my husband and I started Catch My Party. And since then, we’ve launched our MiloTree pop-up app.
Jillian Leslie 0:29
And now, MiloTreeCart, which is the easiest way for you female creators to sell digital products to your audience, like digital downloads, or workshops or memberships, coaching courses, you can do it all with MiloTreeCart. It’s so interesting.
Women Aren’t Bad at Technology, Technology is Bad for Women
Jillian Leslie 0:51
I was on a bunch of coaching calls this week, and I kept hearing a theme. Women telling me they were bad at tech. And I want you to know I feel that way sometimes about myself. But the truth is, I think tech is bad at us. I don’t think that tech pros are building platforms, tools for females, for women.
Jillian Leslie 1:16
And guess what we are because I understand what it’s like to be a creator wearing so many hats having to manage so many platforms. So, our philosophy is always how can we get you up and selling within 10 minutes with sales pages that are seriously fill in the blank.
Jillian Leslie 1:38
This is where you get to put B- work to the test, go start putting products up and seeing if your audience wants to buy them. And we listened to you because you said you wanted a lifetime deal one time payment. That’s it, you own it forever.
Jillian Leslie 1:54
You can buy MiloTreeCart right now for our introductory price. At $349. We offer a 30-day no questions asked money back guarantee. So, there is no risk, head to milotreecart.com to sign up and to no longer feel that you are bad at technology.
Jillian Leslie 2:15
For today’s episode, I have my friend Kate Doster, back on the show. This is her third appearance. And she is one of the smartest minds when it comes to email marketing.
Jillian Leslie 2:26
And she is so generous with what she shares. We talk about how to put together an email sequence to sell your offer. We go piece by piece. You will be taking notes with this episode.
Jillian Leslie 2:42
So, without further delay, here is my interview with Kate Doster. Kate, welcome back to the show. It is so good to see you.
Kate Doster 2:51
It’s so nice to see you too. Hey everybody.
Jillian Leslie 2:51
It’s been a long time. In fact, you’ve been on my podcast two times before. So, I will link to those in the shownotes. Kate, you are like one of my email experts that I go to.
Jillian Leslie 3:01
And that’s what I want to talk about today. But will you briefly just share how you got into this? How you got into teaching email and where you are today?
Sales Tip: People Love to Buy Things
Kate Doster 3:15
Sure. So hey, everybody, I am Kate Doster. And it’s my soul and soul’s mission to put money in the hands of good people. So, they can do good with it and eradicate this idea that nice people have to finish last in business. Because the truth is, people love to buy things.
Kate Doster 3:30
If I called you out and asked you when was the last time you gave Jeff Bezos money on Amazon? I guarantee it was in last seven days because most people have.
Kate Doster 3:37
So, wouldn’t you rather that your people get taken care of by somebody who actually cares about them who’s not going to treat them as a commodity or number or lifetime value or any of that growth stuff? Nobody would.
Kate Doster 3:47
We help people do that through email marketing and easiest offers and just being able to show up as you. And be able to communicate in a value that registers with the human brains because brains are not logical, or else the smoking industry would not be a thing.
Kate Doster 4:01
Why are you going to have something you’re going to have to spend hundreds of thousands of dollars on that it’s going to shorten your life potentially take away your job, it makes no sense. But people still smoke.
Jillian Leslie 4:11
Kate Doster 4:13
I help with SEO. And I ended up in email marketing, because I was a copywriter with a “W”. And that means I got paid to write words. Honestly, that made people hit buttons truly. And when you’re a copywriter, you write a lot of different things, home pages, about pages, sales pages.
Your Email List is Going to Convert Higher Than Social Media
Kate Doster 4:29
I just loved writing email sequences, because it was like I was writing to people’s friends. And your email list it’s been proven time and time again that it’s going to convert higher because there’s nothing wrong with selling on social media.
Kate Doster 4:41
And I think that if you’re like, “Oh, I’m just doing one thing.” You’re cutting yourself short of all the people that you can help. Think about it on Instagram, how many people are you following? Probably 200, 500, 1000s. You are not subscribed to 1,000 newsletters. You’re not even subscribed to 200 newsletters.
Kate Doster 4:41
You’re only subscribed to the handful of people that you truly do want to hear from and get value from, which means those people are in it to win it. So, that is why people on your email list are so much more likely to buy.
Jillian Leslie 5:13
We have launched MiloTreeCart, which as I was explaining to Kate is a way for creators and bloggers to sell their products, their knowledge directly to their audiences in email list.
Jillian Leslie 5:29
So, these are things like workshops, and digital downloads, and webinars and memberships and coaching, any kind of product that you can deliver via technology. That’s really what we’re trying to offer.
Jillian Leslie 5:44
And because I feel like so many people who are listening to this show, are probably monetizing via ads on their site or working with sponsors. If you have an audience, you are leaving a lot of money on the table.
Why You Need to Be Selling Products and Services to Your Audience
Jillian Leslie 5:57
And I like you want to empower people, to go grab that money to take that because chances are you are putting out real value into the world. And you should be paid for that. So, that was why I said Kate, come on my show. Let’s talk about selling and selling through email.
Kate Doster 6:19
Again, you think about it, treat people like people, that’s one of my biggest mottos. We just talked about the human brain is not logical. If people give you money, they’re more likely to actually see success.
Kate Doster 6:30
I’m not going to call the listeners of this podcast. But I know for a fact as I listen to this podcast, the amount of great advice that’s on here is fantastic. But because it’s free, maybe you’re listening to it, as you’re cleaning or grocery shopping or walking, chances are, it’s going in one ear and out the other.
Kate Doster 6:45
But if you actually sat down and paid Jillian, for her coaching, for her memberships, for those sorts of things, you are going to take it more seriously. And I know that all of you guys just want to help out your people.
We Value What We Pay For
Kate Doster 6:57
So, why not give them the edge of them honestly bet on themselves and hedge their bets, that I’m actually going to do something because I paid for it. Again, we all know really that value you get from Target. Who cares if your kids get gross stuff on there.
Kate Doster 7:12
But if you buy like a Coach bag, or like a Louis Vuitton like that one golden purse. It’s up in the closet, it’s in the dust bag, no one can breathe on it your kids can’t look at it can’t be in the room with it. Because you paid more for it, you’re going to take it more seriously.
Kate Doster 7:26
And so, when you start flipping that it’s like, “Oh, now it’s like just grabbing dollars.” But no, I’m pushing success. I am empowering people to actually be able to get dinner on the table and not have to go to the McDonald’s drive-thru if they don’t want to.
Kate Doster 7:40
I’m helping people actually be able to organize their paperwork. So God forbid, when awful things happen. They know where the birth certificates are, they know where the deed to the house is. These are the things that you are going to help people do by charging the money. It just is.
Jillian Leslie 7:54
I just have to say I had this conversation with a friend of mine who has an enormous TikTok following like 150,000 followers, and she does kids’ activities. And I said to her, I will help you one-on-one set up a paid workshop where you do like three cool science experiments for toddlers.
Jillian Leslie 8:19
And walk through it in an hour for mom so that they could do cool stuff with their kids. And when I said charge something like $27 for a mom to show up to have these cool things that they can pull out at any time for their kids.
Jillian Leslie 8:39
And she said to me, “I can’t do it.” And I said, “Why?” And she said, “Because I give it all away for free and then I feel bad charging.”
Kate Doster 8:52
No, honestly and I don’t know if next time you’re going to talk to her is but you have to present even especially with the audience of that size. And knowing TikTok sometimes it’s very hard for creators to get back in front of even their own audiences.
Kate Doster 9:05
But I guarantee you there are people that watch her every single day that love her. They’re just looking for a way to support her.
Kate Doster 9:10
Because she honestly might just have moms just give her the money to be like thank you so much for showing up for getting me through the pandemic if she’s been around that for because my kids love this other stuff. Just go ahead and yeah, some people going to bitch, of course, but who cares? Who cares?
Kate Doster 9:25
Why are you not going to let Samantha feel great about herself because she’s finally helping out a creator. She finally has a way to support them besides just a like on a TikTok, because Barbara over here is going to complain. No.
Mothers Are Not Good At Selling
Jillian Leslie 9:37
I love that. So, I feel because many in my audience are mothers and we give and I don’t charge my daughter for good snacks. It feels icky. And I have this whole philosophy now which is oh I don’t want to feel salesy, and I go go feel salesy, because chances are your feeling of salesy is probably not even aggressive enough.
Kate Doster 10:08
And I don’t think that you need to be aggressive. That’s the thing. For some reason people always default to like their worst sales experience when they are then themselves trying to sell. So, they think about the really pushy people at the mall kiosk. They’re like, “Oh,” and they try to get polish on your nails.
Kate Doster 10:24
They think about the car salesman that speaks over them. Or, in our particular case, not the truck that I just bought for my husband. But our last car that we bought, I’m the breadwinner, my husband is a stay-at-home dad, I paid cash for both of our vehicles. The guy didn’t even look me in the face once. Because I was a female.
Kate Doster 10:42
“Well, what do you do?” My husband says, “I’m going to stand him down.” He’s like, “Oh.” I’m like, “Yes, I’m a CEO of a seven figure company. That’s why he’s a stay-at-home dad.”
Kate Doster 10:51
So, I think that when people are bringing in all of this negative energy around it, I like the word energy, some people resonate more with mindset, some people like mass to vote, but energy around it, that’s the issue.
Kate Doster 11:02
When you are channeling that Sham Wow guy, and you’re just literally repeating yourself, and you’re forcing it down people’s throats, you’re completely correct, it’s going to feel awful. But if you think about the benefits, so what is so great about having these kids’ activities. What is so great about having dinner prepared.
Kate Doster 11:20
And you also think about the flip side about what not having those things done is doing to people. And it’s not that you need to sound negative, it’s like, oh, if you don’t end up buying MiloTreeCart, you’re going to die poor and penniless. And when the cops find you, your face is going to be half eaten off by the cat, no.
Kate Doster 11:37
And so, you could very well be spending all of your time fooling around with and then I would actually name probably a competitor, we don’t want to hear that you just want all your time playing around with this. Or you can just let me handle it.
Kate Doster 11:47
So, that way you can spend more of your time. And then again, you would give we call them moments. And I believe we talked about this last time as well. Spending time with your kids planning out today.
Kate Doster 11:57
You can have time to be able to create new products to be able to create your tip talks and not feel like at the end of the day, “Oh my goodness, I had no time for anything. “To be able to go to Whole Foods and just buy the raspberries and then not matter how much they cost because you want them.
Kate Doster 12:10
And you made the money from them. And you did it by helping people and giving them an advantage. So, I think that’s where everyone needs to realize like, oh, if I don’t make it about the product. Obviously, you need to mention it.
Kate Doster 12:23
But if I don’t make it about the product, and I make it about the person, and what is going on in their lives, and how this can improve something or take something away. And again, we’re not doing huge leaps here everybody. Like my meal planner is not going to be able to X, Y and Z.
Kate Doster 12:41
I’m just happy that it’s Thursday, and I don’t have the kids being like, “What are we going to feed everybody after cheer?” That makes my life easier. I want that easy button and I will gladly pay you for an easy button. So, that’s the way I want you to start thinking of it and not just relying on things like urgency and scarcity.
Kate Doster 12:57
Scarcity, like, “There’s only five left!” You can’t do that in digital products, there’s always going to be more than five. And urgency, it’s like, “The cart is closing or the discount is going away, the discount is going away.” At some point, you do need to remind them the discount is going away.
Setting Up Your First Sales Emails in the Sequence
Kate Doster 13:10
But in your first couple of sales’ emails, you’re literally just going to be like, I know, this is happening, which is why you need to be able to have A, B and C. And guess what? This product has it all there for you. So, that way you can why. Like you can get it for 25% off for the next hour. Do it how it’s best for them.
Jillian Leslie 13:30
Let’s talk about this. So, I create Toddler Science Experiments and Crafts. And I am going to say, “Kate, walk me through this. I don’t feel comfortable selling, I feel weird because I give it away for free. I’m going to charge $27.”
Jillian Leslie 13:51
“I’m going to show up for an hour on Zoom and love on you and give you these awesome things you can do with your kids, including a PDF with all the stuff you need to buy. And you can have the recording so that you can watch this 1,000 times.”
Jillian Leslie 14:08
How do I approach my email sales strategy? How many emails for example?
Sale Tip: Get Over Yourself When It Comes to Selling
Kate Doster 14:17
Sure. The first thing that you’re going to have to do is get over yourself when it comes to selling. I think that we’ve really talked a lot about energetics because if you are not so unbelievably excited again, not for the product, but for what your person’s after is going to be.
Jillian Leslie 14:32
So, their transformation.
Kate Doster 14:34
It’s not going to come across and. Again, I think people think transformation I think like big grandiose because you are used to things like, at least here in the states remember the Biggest Loser where people would drop hundreds of pounds and you’re like, “Oh.” No, we’re not talking about big things here.
Kate Doster 14:48
We are just like, “Oh, their Saturday morning run more smoothly.” So, now they weren’t late to cheer practice because they didn’t have to fumble around to find their keys because they had actually organized their entry way thanks to your PDF. We’re not talk about huge stuff here.
Kate Doster 15:02
So, I need you to get over yourself and think to yourself before you even sit down to write your first sales email, I always tell people, especially if they’re very averse to sales. One, I want you to put on your favorite music ever.
Kate Doster 15:13
Whatever songs that jams you out. Some people, it’s Eminem, some people it’s like, 90s hip hop, whatever is going to make you smile. Whatever is going to make you smile, you’re going to put that on. “I need to try in silence” You’re going to listen to it first. But you can go in silence.
Kate Doster 15:28
So, depending on when this live workshop is going to take place, because I don’t know if that’s one of the perks of it being live. And that’s for $27.
Jillian Leslie 15:36
Yes. If you’re going to show up live, then you get the recording.
Kate Doster 15:40
Then I would probably because it’s only $27. I won’t say only because I do think that’s a great sum of money, it’s not going to need something. If you guys felt similarly, like Amy Porterfield, who literally does five month long launches with 80 different projects, and like, oh, no, you don’t need any of that stuff, any of that stuff.
Launch Your Product in 10-14 Days
Kate Doster 15:58
Because you want to give people some time, I would say probably about two weeks, or a week and a half. You can be like subtly hinting about it, but not necessarily putting somebody in front of a checkout page quite yet. But you want to be hinting at that.
Kate Doster 16:14
What’s really great about this is you don’t necessarily have to pick the activities out of thin hair, you can literally have an email go out, say two or even three weeks before.
Kate Doster 16:23
You’re going to have your live workshop with, “Hey, I want to put together some of the absolute best kids’ activities that I have, where you’re going to be able. We can probably put some of them together, I’ll make sure to send you a list fast. If you sign up early enough, you can ask me any of your questions.”
Kate Doster 16:35
“You can bring your toddler around; we’re going to have a fun time. But I can’t decide between these five. So, what ones do you want to actually see? Or what is your toddler most interested in?”
To Start, Ask Your Audience a Question to Get Them Excited
Kate Doster 16:44
Again, you can ask these questions so that way people are starting to and have a name for it. So, people can start being like, “Oh, she’s got this thing. And it’s coming up soon.” So, get that in there.
Kate Doster 16:55
So, now we’re ready to open the cart, you are going to find that you’re most likely going to get the most sales, the first email that you send out and the last one. And you’re going to literally send out that last one, like two hours before it starts. This is how people are. People procrastinate.
Kate Doster 17:11
And so, I don’t want you thinking like, “Oh, my goodness, I sent out that first email and nobody bought.” No. Analytics are a little bit harder to track, which is a good thing because of privacy policies and stuff like that. Not every open is going to register on any email service writer, none are better than the other ones.
Kate Doster 17:27
Because they’re not going to break the law. None of them are. But it could be especially because you’re targeting busy moms, you sent it on a Wednesday, she didn’t get to check her email until Friday, you got buried on the next page, and no one’s getting to the next page of their emails. It’s just not going to happen.
Kate Doster 17:42
Chances are you landed in the promo tab because most people have Gmail. And that when someone is looking on their cell phone, it comes through the main inbox anyway. So, you don’t have to worry about like, “Oh, do I need to be a primary?” No, they’re going to see your email.
Kate Doster 17:53
They’re not going to see if they have all these other emails. So, that’s why you can’t again, just because Barbara and be like, oh my goodness, she sent me two emails about this amazing thing. And like complain.
Send 5 Emails in Your Sequence
Kate Doster 18:02
Don’t let Sally who really wants to show up never know about it. Because you were so afraid of one negative Nancy. And you’re going to be thinking about, maybe you would send maybe like five-ish emails.
Jillian Leslie 18:16
Five-ish emails through, let’s say, a two week launch. Two week launch. How many emails?
Kate Doster 18:24
Your are going to send one if you haven’t been talking about this, that’s the other thing. You probably the week before should have been talking about, science projects, or the one activity that’s been proven to help your toddler in school the most right, give them reasons to be interested in live science. This is like key.
Kate Doster 18:44
Again, three things to get your kids to stay still, the last one happens to be something that’s engaging and interactive and uses their hands. And guess what, next week, you got something that’s going to do just that. So, you’re still giving them tips, you’re still giving them a lot of value. And you’re just seeding in to set a trap.
Kate Doster 19:01
So, when it is actually sort of opened, I would never do a subject line. This is me personally, I would do something like, “Science workshop open!” And then all exclamation points. Again, eventually and probably towards the end like last chance to get in the workshop. That makes sense.
First Email: Talk About the Benefits of Your Product
Kate Doster 19:22
Because people will open that one who’ve been on the fence or maybe people who haven’t been paying attention. Again, what’s the benefit? I got your next Saturday planned. Don’t worry about rainy days with your kids.
Kate Doster 19:33
And you can even include little parentheses like masterclass workshop, all email service providers to let you not only do a subject line, but you can do I felt like the hint text, but essentially be like the sub headline.
Kate Doster 19:46
When you’re in mobile, you know how you like to start pre-reading an email. You can go ahead and you can set that up to maybe have the name of the workshop. And again, this is really great. We’re going to talk about again, the benefits.
Kate Doster 19:58
Maybe you could talk about last week or two weeks ago, I’d asked you guys about activities everyone was interested in. And by far it was frogs, rockets and crystals.
Kate Doster 20:07
So, I have put together this one workshop where we are going to go over and then I can talk a little bit about the experiments and benefits. And you’re going to be able to get this this this for $27.
Kate Doster 20:19
And don’t worry if you cannot make it live, even though let’s be honest, we’re going to have most fun live. But I know how these kids naps times they like to not take those; you get lifetime access to the replay.
Email 2: Talk About the Objections
Kate Doster 20:19
So, the next email, you might think to yourself, and we talked about this before, I always like to think of yeah-buts. So, I base it off of the Sir Mix up principle, because just like he likes big bucks, so does your email list and so does your wallet.
Kate Doster 20:44
So, what objections what you’ve got with somebody have about coming to this workshop? You hosting it? Or the topic in general? Usually, towards the beginning, it’s like the topic in general, and all that sort of stuff. And a very little bit of you, to be honest.
Kate Doster 20:59
What do you mean by that?
Kate Doster 21:02
Can they trust you to be the person to try to get it?
Jillian Leslie 21:04
Got it. So, in the beginning, it’s like, you might think these are complicated.
Kate Doster 21:09
Why waste my time I’m doing science activities.
Jillian Leslie 21:11
It’s too expensive. Too hard. I don’t like science.
Kate Doster 21:15
People are always going to think it’s expensive. And again, it’s what do they value? I just paid an obscene amount of money for some lifting shoes, because I’m into powerlifting. But I didn’t care, because they are powerlifting shoes. Now, if you had gotten me to buy a normal pair of sneakers for that, it never would have happened.
Kate Doster 21:34
I will buy $4 shirts, but I will buy $50 shorts. It’s just one of those things.
Jillian Leslie 21:39
How much were the shoes by the way? I have to ask you; how much were the powerlifting shoes?
Kate Doster 21:43
The shoes were supposed to be $199. But I got them on sale for $129 which shocking because I was ready to pay the $200 because I needed them.
Kate Doster 21:53
Again, most people are not going to prioritize powerlifting shoes. That’s not going to be like key. That’s not how they want to spend their $200. It’s just like, again, why is it worth their while? Why is it worth the child’s while? And again, you’re not supposed to make some big outlandish claims. It’s just some fun things.
Kate Doster 22:10
If people have already purchased right be like, we’re so excited. I wouldn’t say necessarily how many spots you’ve sold. But welcoming so many people in and really your whole job during any launch is to keep your energy up.
Kate Doster 22:22
So, say you did send out that first email. And you didn’t get any sales for those first couple of days. It is completely okay. The next email you’re going to send out is going to be tackling a yeah-but.
Jillian Leslie 22:32
So is it one yeah-but or a bunch of yeah-buts.
Email 3: Address Your Customers’ FAQs
Kate Doster 22:35
I would just do one. And then the next email after that can be some frequently asked questions. Again, frequently asked questions, will I get to keep it? About how much is it going to cost me and supplies? How is this different, then?
Kate Doster 22:51
I think that that, especially how is this different then I think is really great, especially towards either the end of the cart. And again, I wouldn’t be like the first email, but it could also be the second email as well, again, how is this different from my TikTok videos? Just straight up say it.
Kate Doster 23:07
So, we’ve been getting a lot of questions about our workshop, and again, you’re going to hyperlink it where we’re going to tackle blank, blank, blank, blank. And one of the questions that came up was, how is this any different from TikTok videos?
Kate Doster 23:17
And first off, I love that people are asking these questions, and then you’re going to go into how is it different? They get them to keep it, they’re going to get their PDF, they’re going to get to interact with you.
Kate Doster 23:29
Maybe you have something where anyone who purchases in that first week, maybe they’re going to help you pick a bonus experiment that you guys are going to do. There’s a lot of different ways that you can put that on there.
Kate Doster 23:42
So again, why would they want to I don’t want to say waste, but sometimes you think it’s a cynic? Why would they want to hang out? Again, why is it worth the $27? And I wouldn’t straight up and say why is this worth $27? Because that seems a little gauche.
Kate Doster 23:57
But it’s talking about everything, like the interaction that they’re going to have with their kids. Maybe it’s some alone time with them, maybe it’s been a cool mom.
Sales Tip: Mirror Your Customers’ Lives Back to Them
Kate Doster 24:05
Maybe it’s actually being able to do activities with your kids that aren’t just coloring or puzzles, or watching Paw Patrol, and you would call out the kid shows, and things of that, because when you can mirror somebody’s life to them, they’re going to be like, yeah, this person gets it.
Kate Doster 24:22
And that’s when you win. And again, another one for this person. Why me sort of scenario. Not that you would ever start an email with why me? It’s, people really enjoy their stuff at showing comments about how engaging they are.
Kate Doster 24:39
Especially if the angle that you’re taking is that you’re from an actual science background. Maybe you were NASA scientists, I don’t know. Maybe something cool, then you would talk about it in an email.
Kate Doster 24:49
So, the last chance when you’re actually going to be closing a cart, or the last time you want to talk about something. I would say probably send two emails that same day just to let them come.
Jillian Leslie 25:00
So let’s say, I’m doing it at noon on Wednesday, I’m going to send an email Tuesday after Tuesday night and Wednesday morning, what is your thought?
Sequence Emails 4 & 5: Send Two Emails Letting People Know the Cart is Closing
Kate Doster 25:09
Yes, I think that works. I think that works. Because you’re doing it at noon time. So, if you’re doing it a little bit later, or they have to buy on Friday and the thing is on Monday then he would send to you on Friday. But again, saying to yourself, like, why would somebody be on the fence, and I always like to lead with empathy.
Kate Doster 25:28
So, hey, I know that you haven’t signed up for this yet. And I just want to share with you there’s absolutely no problem with that. I always like to give people this out. But if it’s one of these things that it just got sent to the bottom of your inbox, if you’re really into nerdy science, like myself.
Kate Doster 25:43
If you want to be able to have children who are interested in exploring, questioning, and honestly, even if you’re a little concerned about the mess, don’t worry, because I have something that’s going to be able to help you with that.
Kate Doster 25:55
Don’t worry, you’re going to get my best tips for cleanups because nobody likes to clean up elephant toothpaste, trust me, it’s way messier than you think, then we would absolutely love to have you and your child at this live workshop.
Kate Doster 26:06
And if you can’t make it, because naptime doesn’t work out, or that’s lunchtime. And if you get off schedule, they turn into a gremlin. No worries at all, you’ll be able to get the replay instantly.
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Should You Change the Email Subject Line and Resend to Your List?
Jillian Leslie 27:16
Now what about that idea of changing the subject line and resending it to the people who didn’t open? So, let’s say we’re doing a two week launch. And you said send five emails.
Kate Doster 27:28
I would do that very early on. I would not do that towards the end.
Jillian Leslie 27:31
So very early, and why?
Kate Doster 27:33
Because email service providers do an awful job at actually the people that have opened. And the emails at the end are more direct. Whereas at the beginning, it can be more like mistakes that kids make. It can be more tips. It can be more education based.
Kate Doster 27:52
Where someone is like, “You literally two days ago just sent me this same email.” They’ll be less likely to respond back.
Jillian Leslie 28:00
What you’re saying is that you don’t think email service providers are good at saying, “Oh, these are the people who are already open.”
Kate Doster 28:08
They can’t be because you can’t track on Apple and you can’t track on Android. Unless somebody is opening up on desktop, there’s really no way.
Jillian Leslie 28:19
Kate Doster 28:22
Yes, obviously. I like to think of it as always playing a video game. I’m not like too mad if I don’t beat Tetris, who cares. But for your open rates, just try to get a little better yourself. See if you can serve notice some tendencies but realize there are going to be people that are opening that it doesn’t say that they opened.
Jillian Leslie 28:39
I did not know this.
Kate Doster 28:40
It’s not going to be a huge amount but it is going to be some people and it is every email service provider all of you, it’s everybody’s, because again, all cell phones usually block the pixel that shoots back to your email service provider.
Kate Doster 28:55
And again, like I said, when it’s a little more casual, asking those questions like what people want, go right ahead. Again, if you want to send one because maybe you wrote a really great, yeah-but email, and you’re just like, that was fantastic.
Kate Doster 29:09
I would say as long as you’ve got 48 hours in between the send, then you can go ahead and do it. I don’t like to send things 24 hours in between because I feel like that’s just not enough time to resend the same exact email.
Jillian Leslie 29:23
That’s such great advice. So, what I’m hearing you say is, it’s not about you get over yourself, which I love. I say this all the time. I say it to myself. I say it to my daughter. I said to anybody that I’m coaching, you are not the star of this movie.
Jillian Leslie 29:44
The star of the movie is the person you are helping and the way that you get them to feel like a star is you say I see you. I know what you’re struggling with. I know what your life looks like. I know what you’re Saturday morning looks like. And therefore, you can trust me, as I have no judgment.
Jillian Leslie 30:07
And I just want to help you. And what I’m going to do is lead you on a journey. So, I’m going to say, “Hey, here’s this cool thing. And this will enable you to have this future version of yourself.”
Talk About Someone’s Future Self, then Sell Your Product
Kate Doster 30:28
I would flip that around; I talk about the future version of them. And then this cool thing.
Jillian Leslie 30:32
So you’re saying, hey, if you want your Saturday morning, to be filled, where your kids are happy and engaged and aren’t just sitting in front of the TV or their screens, I’ve got this.
Jillian Leslie 30:45
So, you are painting the picture who doesn’t want their kids to be engaged and not sitting in front of screens on a Saturday morning? That sounds great.
Kate Doster 30:56
Without having to clean up a giant mess afterwards.
Jillian Leslie 30:59
Yes. Or the idea of like, “Hey, have you ever been that person who puts out all these great art supplies, and then your kid just does it for four minutes, and then you end up cleaning up the mess while they’re sitting in front of screens?”
Jillian Leslie 31:14
So it’s like, “Here’s this future that I’m going to paint for you that looks pretty good. And I now have a way for you to get there.” And that’s what I’m leaning into. Then it goes to, “Okay, you don’t believe me? I’m going to address the yeah-buts.”
Jillian Leslie 31:34
Because my kid is different. So it’s like, “Oh, no, my kid can’t sit still for 10 minutes.” And it’s like, “Hey, if you have one of those kids, that has a hard time sitting still trust me. I have done this experiment with so many kids. And this is the one.”
Kate Doster 31:50
I wouldn’t say trust me; I would say what you would need to do in order to keep kids engaged, which is why in this cool thing, we do exactly that.
Jillian Leslie 32:00
So, you would be like, “Here are the strategies to keep kids engaged. And this thing will do that.”
Kate Doster 32:12
Jillian Leslie 32:15
And then after I’ve done yeah-buts, then I’m going to continue to lean into painting this future picture, I’m going to look where do I go from there, as I’m teeing up the sale and the ticking clock?
Kate Doster 32:29
For the ticking clock and all that sort of stuff, towards the end, it’s usually frequently asked questions email, because if somebody is on the fence, and you can pull that straight from your sales page. We will do something if you haven’t necessarily addressed time yet, you could address time.
Jillian Leslie 32:46
What do you mean?
Kate Doster 32:47
That’s an issue, like they don’t have any time to get it done, they can’t get actually time to get the supplies, all of that sort of stuff you can address at the end.
Kate Doster 32:54
Because by the end, if they are still opening up your emails, and they haven’t bought yet, then chances are they don’t believe that they can have the success that you’re saying. That’s why it’s like, alright. So that’s just something to think about.
Kate Doster 33:13
It’s not like you would ever say in an email, “I know. I’ve tried to get my kids through activities before and they never work. And I know that you’re the same way failure of a parent.” No, we’re never going to say anything like that. This also comes down to product creation. How can we stack the deck in their favor?
Sales Tip: Offer a Money Back Guarantee to Get Them off the Fence
Jillian Leslie 33:34
So could you say something like, “Hey, if you do this, you don’t like it. I’ll give you your money back.”
Kate Doster 33:40
Yes, you can have guarantees to go with those things. And you’d be surprised a lot less people will ask back for their money. I guarantee you, it’s not everybody. But some people like the risk reversal, like it is quite alright, you can go ahead and do that.
Kate Doster 33:53
Again, you’re only going to end up with the same exact money you started with, if that makes sense. You didn’t have the $27 before. So, you just won’t have the $27 after.
Jillian Leslie 34:02
Kate Doster 34:03
But it will definitely be fine. So, like you said, you can talk a little bit more about the guarantee, you can and that final email, if you feel like price is really an issue. Maybe it’s like, “Hey, I just wanted to let you know, we’re going to be starting the science workshop was going to do this, this and this in a couple of hours.”
Kate Doster 34:20
It’s only time we’re really leading with that, because they’ve got to make a decision. And I understand that sometimes you just don’t want to justify $27 and that it could go to, I wouldn’t just say other things, I would name those other things.
Kate Doster 34:33
And you’re right because people love knowing that they are right. And you’re right, you could 100% use $27 to get your kids pizza and a movie, which would be fun. Everybody loves snuggles, or you could spend it on your shoes.
Kate Doster 34:45
You could talk about some of the other things, and then you can throw in a but. When you’re sitting down and you’re engaging with your child.
Kate Doster 34:53
When you’re exposing them early to the love of science and their curiosity, and yeah, you might get a little bit messy that’s where the true memory making is going to come in, and we cannot wait to have you and then however you like to refer to kids, “Come hang out with us.”
Jillian Leslie 35:08
Oh my God, I feel like I need to copy that script. That was beautiful. That was terrific. Now what about a late discount, or an extra bonus?
Should You Offer Late Discounts or an Extra Bonus?
Kate Doster 35:19
I don’t like to late discounts because I’m not going to reward you for waiting. I would much rather reward people who take action. But that’s just me. You’re going to literally hear it in my voice. Like no. No.
Kate Doster 35:30
If you are going to be in it to win it at the beginning, I would much rather you get the 10% off or the 15% off or a bonus item. It’s for the action takers. If you want to take action, take action. I don’t need to water stuff down. To me, I have to be honest, I just think that sounds desperate.
Kate Doster 35:47
Other business models do not believe that. I can think of one person that I know. And I love her to death. And she’s wicked smart. And she discounts stuff all of the time. That was her business model. She runs her digital product business more like an Ecommerce business does, like, you know, Kohl’s always has sales.
Kate Doster 36:04
So, that’s the business model that she chose to have. And that’s fine. I don’t think that she offers private discounts. She might, but I’m pretty sure it’s just like, “Hey, everybody, it’s Thursday. And Thursday is deal day.” That’s not the day of the week, everybody. But that’s fine. She likes to do that.
Kate Doster 36:19
But again, if I’m doing something and it’s live, then I’m going to reward the people who buy first.
Jillian Leslie 36:26
So, would you do that in one of your first emails? “Hey, if you buy by Wednesday, you’re going to get these items bonus.”
Kate Doster 36:35
For the added bonuses, yes. I always love giving people more stuff than necessarily giving them money off. But if it feels better for you to be like, I told them it was $13.27. But I can get my energy behind like $19. Again, whatever one you feel best about then offer it at an early bird discount.
Kate Doster 36:56
Again, for sure are we going to do this? And then yeah, are you going to notice that the sales are going to be the first day and the last day the discount you’re going to get the majority? Absolutely. Are you going to get people the next day? They’re going to go, “Oh, I missed a discount. Can I have it?”
Kate Doster 37:08
And you need to stick to your guns and be in integrity like, “No, no, you can’t.” Because that’s not fair to the other people who have already bought without the discount. You have to stay in integrity, it’s very, very important. I know, it can be really hard. I know it can really hard.
Kate Doster 37:21
And then at the end, you’ll have more sales again when the cart closes. But you don’t just have to do this for things that open and close. You can have a product suite or smaller products or I know a lot of my students have binders and stuff and every once in a while, just do a newsletter that’s about that.
Keep Selling Products in Your Newsletters
Kate Doster 37:40
Again, remember, we talked about ways to get your kids to actually be engaged. And the third one is to have interactive projects. Well, guess what? You’re literally going to say the sentence which is why in my playtime binder 98% of activities are focused on this business and it’s only $24.
Jillian Leslie 37:56
I love that.
Kate Doster 37:57
People don’t know everything that you sell. You don’t have to make this. People overthink this. And they overhype this, this is a big problem because they’re afraid of rejection. And then if they make it hard, and have to be like I call it strategically from SNL, which is strategic.
Kate Doster 38:14
If they have to overhype this and overcomplicate it, well, then they have an out for why it didn’t work. When you just make it simple, you’re like, oh, making it simple on yourself. Again, all I have are just things that are available all the time.
Kate Doster 38:29
And I don’t particularly feel like discounting right now, you know a blog post, or you just hyperlink stuff, hyperlink stuff every once in a while. You can make a casual selling, you don’t have to do this big launch thing, because I know it can be really intimidating. And that’s what I have all my students do at the beginning.
Jillian Leslie 38:46
I am all about done is better than perfect. I am all about test test test. So, the way that MiloTreeCart works is we sell it for $349. And you own it forever. And then you can just sell sell, sell test, test, test, try it, put it up there, create a free sales page, see if this is what your audience wants from you learn, go. They like this.
Kate Doster 39:10
You cannot tell people something once and expect them to buy and like everyone to buy. How many times did you have to tell your kids to pick up their socks today?
Jillian Leslie 39:19
Totally. Well, what’s interesting is people do a one hour paid workshop. They’ve had the recording, and then they go back to their list and sell it. So, the people who didn’t buy it the first time didn’t show up live. Alright, guess what, you’ve now got this asset.
Jillian Leslie 39:35
And then every so often people have gone back to their list and sold it over and over again. I’m saying maybe every six months. So, you don’t want to inundate your people with it. But it’s amazing, but you would never know that if you didn’t test it.
Kate Doster 39:51
No. And again, you would be surprised because not everybody is going to be hunting down your website and looking for your offers or your shop page. Especially if you don’t even have one of those because you just do like a one off thing and you don’t feel like selling the replay. How are people going to know? They’re not.
Kate Doster 40:10
Maybe and I was talking to someone. She’s a photographer. So, it’s a very different business model. She had done mini sessions, I think she had done them over the summer, because that was her low period, but not a whole bunch of really spot on.
Kate Doster 40:21
Honestly, it’s probably just because people were away on vacation. And I guarantee if you run one now and talk about it, like back to school or pre-holiday, like mini-session, people are going to buy it, because it makes sense at this time of the year.
Think In Terms of Calendar Cycles for Selling
Kate Doster 40:37
Again, that’s why think of actual stores everyone things are in cycles. It makes a lot of sense. When people are in September, what are the things they are thinking about. They’re thinking about back to school.
Kate Doster 40:48
Sometimes, at least for other business owners, especially if they’re like us and their moms, you’re getting back to business. Gretchen Rubin once said that September was the new January.
Jillian Leslie 40:57
Kate Doster 40:58
In January, everybody wants all the new habits. So, if you got organization binder, a budget binder, a kid’s activity binder. They want the best version of themselves in January. And guess what also happens in January, ad revenue tanks.
Kate Doster 41:15
So, how you going to make money the rest of the year when you know that Q4 is the only and best time let’s be real, only and best time to have ads on your website. Well, now we’ve at least got January and some of February are taken care of because we are going to go off of what people are naturally already thinking about.
Kate Doster 41:33
And guess what comes after that spring cleaning, boom, you got something. Again, if this fits your audience, so there’s always something that can work out. And I know, all of us have international audiences.
Kate Doster 41:43
So, I do try to make sure that I say that in my emails it’s like, “And for all my Aussie friends, I’m aware that it’s wintertime. And everyone else is neglecting you. But if you are in the house bored, or you’ve got the winter blues, and you haven’t been able to do much, this is going to help too.”
Kate Doster 42:06
Again, you can address these things don’t come up with all these big bad reasons not to try and that’s again, why I love Jillian, so much like she said, “Done is better than perfect.” And I understand that you want to be the absolute best for your audience and that you care about them. Let it go take a shot with you.
Jillian Leslie 42:21
But it goes back to that. And again, I talked about B- work, which is by the way, above average. So, I’m not saying do crappy work. I’m saying put your best effort there. But there’s no such thing as A+ work even though you think there is and that is just like a way to never get anything done.
Jillian Leslie 42:37
So, think about B- work and showing up real like we started this conversation. People want to interact with real people. I always say this. So, I write emails once a week. And sometimes my emails have a typo. And of course, there’s that moment when I cringe if I reread it go uh.
Jillian Leslie 42:58
And then I go you know what, if somebody is annoyed that I have a typo, they can unsubscribe, they’re not my people. And I am saying I’m showing up real.
Kate Doster 43:08
That means that you took action. Because if you didn’t take action. Again, this is for the entrepreneurs of the world. If you did not take action, you would have had a typo in the first place.
Should You Add Emojis to Your Emails?
Jillian Leslie 43:17
Exactly. I love that. Quick questions. One, emojis yes or no?
Kate Doster 43:24
If it fits your brand, I say go for it. That’s one of those things that you could test. So, now that you’re going to resend the same email, but every email service provider does allow you to do something called AB testing. So, test it out and see if having the paintbrush actually makes people open up more. I say sure.
Jillian Leslie 43:40
Great. And length of emails. Are these novels?
Kate Doster 43:45
I think that it’s going to depend, again, treat people like people, why are they going to their inbox for dopamine hit because their kids soccer game is boring, because they’re supposed to be writing a sales page if they’re a business owner.
Kate Doster 43:55
They’re going to procrastinate; you can have it be as long as you can keep it interesting. So, if your frequently asked questions, email, it’s going to be pretty long, because your frequent ask questions might be pretty long.
Kate Doster 44:06
That’s why it’s towards the end, and only people who are super interested in the product are going to read it.
Jillian Leslie 44:11
Kate Doster 44:11
So, that’s fine. At the beginning. Again, we’re keeping engaged. That’s why in that email, if we’re talking about ways to get kids to sit still, we’re not going to have one of those mega blog posts is like 99 ways to get your kids to sit still. It’s the three best ways to keep your kid still or paying attention.
Kate Doster 44:27
Oh, I can handle three. So someone is going to read it. And it’s entertaining. Again, you’ll read a novel all day long and after that be like, “Oh my goodness, there are too many words.”
Jillian Leslie 44:34
Kate Doster 44:35
Who wants to sit down and read the encyclopedia? And I don’t want you think like, “Oh, I need great storytelling.” No, you need to be relatable. As I always tell my students, people like to buy from people who they feel like are their friends.
Kate Doster 44:48
And the people that are their friends are the ones that understand them. It’s not something that’s making grandiose statements, like get your kids to listen to you. It’s get your kids to pick up their socks about starting World War III. “Oh, my goodness. How does she know that happens every time in my house?”
Kate Doster 45:02
That’s going to build that natural know, like and trust and that’s why they’re going to want to be with you. So, don’t overcomplicate things.
Jillian Leslie 45:08
Kate, I love this. Honestly, you are just I don’t know providing so much value you so inspired me because I have to write some emails today. So, I feel really like hopped up. Kate, if people want to reach out to you learn more about you figure out how to write these emails with your help, where should they go?
Kate Doster 45:31
Sure. So, we’re just kicking off the new season of my podcast Inbox Besties. So, if you’re in the podcast, definitely come over for that. Again, anywhere you’re listening to this podcast after you leave Jillian a review for how great she is, then go ahead and just hit the search button.
Kate Doster 45:45
You can also search for Kate Doster. I’ve been hanging out on Instagram just to have a lot of fun there. I mentioned powerlifting, because that’s what one does when they turn 37. I share a lot about that on my Instagram stories because it can read fun there. And that’s kate_doster.
Kate Doster 46:00
I have an email list, but I haven’t talked to them in forever, you can head on over to Katedoster.com/2years. And that will give you two years worth of strategically planned email ideas where it’s literally like week 3 of August send this, week 2 of March send that.
Kate Doster 46:19
And so, some people will just send it like verbatim and they absolutely love it. Again, it’s not written out, it’s just a prompt to get your brain going. Other people like to skip around. But when your brain has something to latch on to, then all of a sudden, it’s a lot less overwhelming. And it can work.
Kate Doster 46:33
And we do have my big course, which opens a couple of times a year called “Love Your List” as well. But if you sign up for my two years worth of email ideas, then you’ll hear about that.
Jillian Leslie 46:43
I have to say I so appreciate you coming back, I’d love you to come back again to share more of these tips. And really, thank you so much for coming on the show.
Kate Doster 46:53
Thank you so much for having me. Just sell everyone. And again, even if you send the five emails or the four emails and you don’t get the results that you want, this has no ramifications on you as a person or you as a business owner.
Kate Doster 47:05
And nobody got 100% unsubscribe rate ever from having a launch. They just did not okay. And all of your email service providers can give you a link where people can opt out of your current launches, but still stay on your list when you’re done.
Jillian Leslie 47:20
I love that. Well, thank you so much. And we will be in touch.
Kate Doster 47:25
Jillian Leslie 47:26
I hope you guys liked this episode; I don’t even know where to start to share what my favorite parts were. I actually took notes after this episode to think about sales structure. And when I was creating templates, email template for MiloTreeCard customers to use I used Kate’s framework.
Jillian Leslie 47:50
I think she approaches selling so strategically making it a win-win both for your customer and for you. And I think that is probably my biggest takeaway.
Jillian Leslie 48:01
Before I go, I want to say that a little over a week and a half ago, I hosted a paid workshop for $10, for people who were curious about selling digital products. And I laid out how to find an idea for your digital product, how to add it to MiloTreeCart, how to test it, and all of the resources that we provide to help you.
Jillian Leslie 48:24
If this is interesting to you. I’m selling the replay again for $10. And you can find it at empire.milotreecart.com because I’m going to lay out how to build your digital product empire even if you’re starting with a $5 eBook.
Jillian Leslie 48:40
And this is interesting to you. I recommend you start here go to empire.milotreecart.com and sign up and if you have any questions about it, just reach out I love hearing from you.
Jillian Leslie 48:55
And I will see you here again next week.
Other Blogger Genius Podcast Episodes You’ll Like:
- #126: How To Show Up Authentically And Sell To Your List with Kate Doster
- #021: How To Set Up An Easy and Effective Email Sales Funnel with Kate Doster (Part 2)
- #020: Why Email Marketing is Exciting and Easy with Kate Doster (Part 1)
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