Steal Her Strategy: Instagram Follower Growth from 2k to 100k in 4 Months

In today’s episode of The Blogger Genius Podcast, I sat down with Petra Atanasova, a Bulgarian vegan and vegetarian food blogger and the creator of Sunglow Kitchen. Petra shared her incredible journey of growing her Instagram followers from 2,000 to over 100,000 in just four months.

The episode delves into the strategies Petra used to achieve this remarkable growth, offering actionable advice and detailed insights for anyone looking to for Instagram follower growth tips.

Petra’s Background and Initial Struggles

Petra’s journey began during the pandemic when she decided to start her blog after experiencing burnout from her job as a chef at a plant-based cafe. Initially, she struggled with her blog’s growth but found success after learning about SEO and optimizing her content.

However, a Google algorithm update caused a significant drop in her traffic, prompting her to diversify her income streams by focusing on Instagram follower growth.

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Key Strategies for Instagram Growth

1. Creating Successful Reels

Petra’s primary strategy for growing her Instagram following was through creating engaging and visually appealing Reels. Here are the key elements she focused on:

Length of Reels: Petra’s Reels are typically between 20 and 30 seconds long. She noted that shorter Reels tend to have higher watch times, which is crucial for retaining viewer attention.

Number of Cuts: Her Reels often contain 30 to 40 cuts, with each shot lasting less than a second. This rapid editing style keeps the content dynamic and engaging.

Content Focus: Petra emphasizes the importance of showing only the most critical movements in her videos. For example, if she’s cutting a cucumber, the reel will only show the knife slicing through the cucumber.

Tools Used: Petra uses CapCut for filming and editing her videos. She shoots in clips rather than long videos to save storage space and make the editing process cleaner.

2. Providing Value and Engaging the Audience

Petra’s approach to content creation is centered around providing value and engaging her audience.

Here are some of her tactics:

Recipe Series: She created a successful recipe series that showcased her expertise as a professional chef. This series not only provided valuable content but also established her authority in her niche.

Call to Action: Petra often includes a call to action in her Reels, such as “Comment ‘tofu’ for the recipe.” She uses ManyChat, an automation app, to send the recipe link to anyone who comments with the specified keyword.

Captions: For recipes that she has blog posts for, Petra includes the ingredients in the caption and directs viewers to her blog for full instructions. For other recipes, she provides the entire recipe in the caption. This strategy has led to higher save rates, which are important for the Instagram algorithm.

3. Using Trending Music

Petra highlighted the importance of using trending music in her Reels. Trending music can increase the chances of your reel being discovered by a wider audience, as Instagram’s algorithm tends to favor content that uses popular audio tracks.

4. Dealing with Controversy

Interestingly, some of Petra’s most viral videos have sparked controversy. For example, one of her videos received comments questioning her credentials as a professional chef. While this initially affected her mental health, Petra learned to view controversy as a way to drive engagement. She now occasionally incorporates controversial elements into her hooks to spark conversation and increase interaction.

Monetizing Instagram Following

1. Creating and Promoting an Ebook

Petra is working on an ebook featuring no-chop recipes, which have been well-received by her audience. She plans to promote this e-book through her successful recipe series and by collecting email addresses from her followers.

2. Offering Consulting Services

I suggested that Petra consider offering consulting services for Instagram audits, given her keen eye for improving Instagram content. This could be a valuable additional income stream for Petra.

3. Brand Partnerships

Petra is also exploring brand partnerships as a way to monetize her Instagram following. By creating high-quality video content for brands, she can leverage her large and engaged audience to generate income.

Maintaining Consistency and Avoiding Burnout

Petra shared some valuable tips for maintaining consistency and avoiding burnout:

Batching Content Creation: By planning and creating content in batches, Petra can stay ahead of her posting schedule and reduce the stress of daily content creation.

Taking Breaks: She emphasized the importance of taking breaks when needed and not being too hard on oneself. This approach helps maintain long-term consistency without compromising mental health.

Conclusion

Petra Attanasova’s journey from 2,000 to 100,000 Instagram followers in just four months is a testament to the power of strategic content creation and audience engagement. So please use her Instagram follower growth strategies.

By focusing on creating high-quality Reels, providing value, and engaging her audience, Petra has built a strong and rapidly growing Instagram presence.

Whether you’re a food blogger or in another niche, Petra’s strategies offer valuable insights that can help you grow your own Instagram following.

If you found this post helpful, please share it with a friend and consider giving The Blogger Genius podcast a five-star rating on iTunes. For more valuable insights and conversations, tune in to the next episode of The Blogger Genius Podcast.

Other Related Blogger Genius Podcast episodes You’ll Enjoy:

• #320: A New, Exciting Way to Make Money with Brand Collaborations with Anca Toderic
• #309: Tips and Tricks for Overcoming Instagram Overwhelm (Rebroadcast)
• Why You Should Write the Ebook You’d Like to Rea with Danielle Turner

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#339 Transcript: Steal Her Strategy—Instagram Follower Growth from 2k to 100k in 4 Months

Jillian Leslie (00:00:06) – Hello and welcome back to the Blogger Genius podcast. I’m your host, Gillian Leslie, founder of MiloTree. If you haven’t heard, MiloTree is your all in one suite for growing your online business. It includes MiloTreeCart, the easiest way to sell digital products in under five minutes. MiloTreeLeads, which allows you to collect email subscribers by offering unlimited freebies and the military pop up app for boosting your social media followers. I’m excited to announce that we’ve just launched MiloTreeLeads exclusively to our MiloTreeCart lifetime deal VIP at an incredibly low monthly price. They’ve started using it and they love it before we roll out. MiloTreeCart and MiloTreeLeads as a subscription service. You can still grab my little tree cart for our lifetime deal of 349, and get military leads for an unbelievably low price. This offer won’t last, so head to milotree.com, sign up today and for these last lifetime deal customers, you get a bonus one hour coaching call again. Head to milotree.com and sign up. Okay, let’s get into today’s episode because it is all about growing your Instagram followers.

Jillian Leslie (00:01:30) – I am interviewing Bulgarian, vegan and vegetarian food blogger Petra Attanasio. Her food blog is called Sun Glow Kitchen and she grew her Instagram followers from 2000 followers to over a hundred thousand followers in Get this. For months I couldn’t believe it and so I had to bring her on the show. Petra goes into how to create successful reels, and she’s really grown her account by creating like three reels a week. It’s amazing what she’s been able to accomplish, and you will want to have a pen and paper ready because she is going to go step by step. She shares how to come up with a theme for a series, how to add movement into your reels, how to add voiceover, and how to get inspired by other people’s reels in your niche. So if you have been hoping to grow your Instagram following, if you’re frustrated with Instagram, this is the episode for you. So without further delay, here is my interview with Petra Attanasio via. Petra. Welcome to the Blogger Genius podcast.

Petra Atanasova (00:02:50) – Thank you so much for having me, Gillian.

Petra Atanasova (00:02:52) – I’m such a big fan of your podcast, so it’s really nice that we get to chat today.

Jillian Leslie (00:02:59) – Yes, and I get to see you too. Okay. Where first, let’s start with where are you located?

Petra Atanasova (00:03:04) – I’m located in Bulgaria.

Jillian Leslie (00:03:06) – Which I think is so cool. I love this about the internet. You could be in Bulgaria, I could be in Austin, and we could be looking at each other having this conversation.

Petra Atanasova (00:03:15) – Yes. Amazing.

Jillian Leslie (00:03:17) – So you reached out to me, your food blogger, and you said, hey, I grew my Instagram account to over 100,000 followers in something like four months. Would this be interesting to talk about on your show? And I’m like, okay, well, send me this, you know, a link to your blog and a link to your Instagram to make sure what you’re telling me is true. And then when I looked, I was like, oh my God, Petra, yes, I do want you to come on my show and share all your strategies and how you were able to do this.

Jillian Leslie (00:03:50) – But before we launch into that, will you share a little bit about your entrepreneurial journey and how you became a food blogger and where you are today?

Petra Atanasova (00:04:03) – Of course. it’s a long story, but I’ll try to make it short. So I used to be a dishwasher at a plant based cafe, and at that time I was vegan myself and was really curious how the chefs were making vegan cheese and vegan meatballs and all of those stuff. And so I started asking them to teach me. I got really close with one of the chefs. He taught me a lot of things. Probably everything I know comes from him. And, at some point a position opened and I started working as a chef at that cafe, even though I had no education and no experience. my boss was kind of like crazy for doing this, but she took me on and I started working as a chef for a few years until I hit burnout. it’s very long shifts for not a lot of money, and my health was wrecked from standing all day working in that stress.

Petra Atanasova (00:05:07) – And that’s when the pandemic came and the place I was working at closed. And so I was left with no job. And I had so much time and I had a little bit of savings and I was like, okay, I’m going to start the blog that I’ve always wanted to start. This is the perfect time. And at first I started on I think it’s blogspot. Google’s free, free platform for a website, and I started on that for a few months. I had no idea what I was doing. I was posting random recipes on this free platform I was promoting in Instagram, but nothing was working. And after a few months I was like, okay, let me buy a course and learn about this. Which the course wasn’t really that good, but the one thing it taught me was that I need to get my blog on WordPress, and I need to get into SEO. And I got my blog on WordPress and I started learning what is SEO, how do I optimize my blog? And then I bought the course cooking with keywords.

Petra Atanasova (00:06:24) – Have you heard of it?

Jillian Leslie (00:06:25) – Yes.

Petra Atanasova (00:06:26) – Cooking with keywords. Yeah. and once I got that course, it was pretty revolutionary for me because it just made so much sense. Why? Nothing was working before that. And once I started doing proper keyword research, once I started optimizing my post, optimizing my blog, I started to build traffic. And and eventually I made it into Mediavine, which was my biggest dream and I was so happy. Once I was in there and everything was good, I was living honestly my best life until Google hit me with an algorithm update and I lost 70% of my traffic.

Jillian Leslie (00:07:15) – Now when was this? When was this?

Petra Atanasova (00:07:19) – So this was in March? No, in December of last year of 2023.

Jillian Leslie (00:07:28) – Did you wake up one day?

Petra Atanasova (00:07:30) – Q4 wake up be.

Jillian Leslie (00:07:32) – Did you wake up one day and see your truck? No.

Petra Atanasova (00:07:35) – It was slowly going down. It was slowly going down, down, down. And sooner rather than later I figured out if it’s going to keep going down, I need to do something about it.

Petra Atanasova (00:07:52) – And, that’s when I signed up for an audit with Casey Markey, which was a few months later. But in the meantime, while I was waiting, I was like, I need a second source of income. I was dependent only on Google and one freelance client for all of my all of my money. And so I was like, I’m going to start Instagram and I’m gonna set a goal for myself by the end of the year, I want to have 100,000 followers.

Jillian Leslie (00:08:28) – And when you started, how many followers did you have?

Petra Atanasova (00:08:31) – I had less than 2000 followers.

Jillian Leslie (00:08:34) – You had less than 2000 followers. So did you. So you go. My goal is to grow my Instagram followers and start making money from Instagram. And when I say, how did you think you would start making money from Instagram?

Petra Atanasova (00:08:52) – my biggest goal was to start working with brands and do brand partnerships. and also to create my own product, to create an ebook or some kind. Of course, because I knew that I can only continue with one source.

Petra Atanasova (00:09:11) – As I said, I can only rely on brand partnerships or rely on Google. I need to have my own product and, Yeah.

Jillian Leslie (00:09:21) – Okay. That again, diversifying your income streams is very smart. So did you. Yes. So you say I’m going to start on Instagram. Did you decide I’m going to take a course. Did you just like what was your thinking. And was this pie in the sky thinking that you could grow it.

Petra Atanasova (00:09:39) – Yeah okay. Great question. So at that time, around that time that I was thinking of growing my Instagram, I met a friend. Her name is Yvonne Nova. She’s doing, art and drawing. I’m just saying, in case anyone is interested, you can check her out. and she has been an amazing influence. So I met her, and she was like, I have 160,000 followers. And I got them in a few weeks from a few videos that have gone viral. And I was like, I didn’t even know that was possible. And she was like, you can do it too.

Petra Atanasova (00:10:25) – She motivated me and she was like, I’m going to help you reach that milestone. And, yeah, it was kind of like having this example that it was possible that I was like, okay, she did it for a few weeks, maybe like two months. I’m going to do it for a year. That’s like, sounds achievable.

Jillian Leslie (00:10:46) – Okay. And what was her name again? Because it kind of broke up. So people want to. Yeah. See who she is?

Petra Atanasova (00:10:51) – Yeah, it’s Cecile Ivanova.

Jillian Leslie (00:10:54) – Okay. Cecile. Ivanova.

Petra Atanasova (00:10:56) – Yeah. Yes, exactly. Okay.

Jillian Leslie (00:10:59) – So you. So what? What does she say? Go do this. What do you start doing?

Petra Atanasova (00:11:05) – So she was like, you need a strategy, and I’m going to help you develop it. So first of all, I picked when I was going to post how many times a week, and I was going to stick to that no matter what. And I picked to upload three videos a week, which was what worked for me.

Petra Atanasova (00:11:31) – Later we’re going to talk about more about what’s the minimum of posting, what’s the maximum, and stuff like that. But I stuck to three times a week. And what I did that led me to, where I am now is I created a really successful recipe series about what I eat as a professional chef and what was very, the key things in the in that series was three things a very appealing visual, a strong hook and providing value for people. And I’m going to break them down one by one. So the first one, appealing visual, I feel like that’s kind of self-explanatory, but you need something to hook the user before even they can, before they can hear what their, what you’re saying or what them or what kind of music is playing. They need to be hooked immediately with what they’re seeing. So in order to do that, I always start my videos with some kind of movement. So your video shouldn’t start with something static. It should be something engaging. Maybe you slicing into a watermelon, or it can also be something pretty simple, but it needs to look delicious.

Petra Atanasova (00:12:59) – It needs to say to the user, this video is worth watching. And after the first three seconds, if you can hook them with that appealing visual, they’re going to continue watching. Okay, so adding movement Kevin it doesn’t even need to be like, a very aesthetic visual. I’ve actually noticed that most of my videos that have gone viral are not, like, super aesthetic. they’re kind of actually me in my kitchen being very relatable because that’s what people want to see. They want to see you in your home, in your kitchen. they want to feel like they’re there with you when you’re cooking your food, right?

Jillian Leslie (00:13:44) – When you say you in your kitchen, is it your face? Is it your hands? What does that mean? You in your kitchen. And then how do you movement?

Petra Atanasova (00:13:53) – Yes. So sometimes it will be me chopping something. Sometimes it will be me, stirring the pot of this delicious pasta. Or sometimes it’s swirling up some spaghetti on the fork. Sometimes it’s biting into something.

Petra Atanasova (00:14:10) – Or maybe, like I said, if you have a huge cauliflower head, you’re cutting into it. You’re adding movement. Sometimes it can. I have had a few videos that start with me talking, but immediately after that it needs to be followed by some kind of moving movement. putting something in a bowl or, dipping a piece of bread into sauce. You get the idea.

Jillian Leslie (00:14:39) – Got it. Okay.

Petra Atanasova (00:14:41) – Yes. the second thing was a strong hook. So what I did that I think was very smart was to establish authority. So my most successful series, as I said, is what I eat as a professional chef. When I’m hungry and tired after work. Right. And so right off the right of the gate, I’m establishing authority. I’m saying I’m a professional chef. And that kind of giving people a reason to care about what I’m going to say. So if you can establish some kind of authority, even if you’re not a chef, you can say, I’ve heard people say I’m a vegan personal trainer, or you can say, that’s for my niche.

Petra Atanasova (00:15:28) – I’ve niche. I’ve been vegan for ten years and this is what I like to make when I’m craving eggs. Or you could say even I’ve been a recipe developer for X amount of time, and if you can establish authority, that will immediately hook the viewer in.

Jillian Leslie (00:15:46) – Now here’s way. Here’s my question. Are you saying this in the videos? Is this in the text where given that you’ve got this short time to hook your viewer and I get it, you got the cauliflower head or the watermelon, you’re cutting into it. You’re going to make something that’s going to make me viscerally want to watch this, right? Because it’s tapping into a variety of almost like I can smell it, right? I can taste it. Exactly. Then are you going? Hi, I’m Petra, here’s here’s my authority. You know, here’s why you should follow me. Like, where does that piece of information come in? So that I am continuing to watch your video.

Petra Atanasova (00:16:32) – Yeah. So I have found that I’ve actually never said follow me for X, Y, and Z because I feel like people need to naturally want to follow you.

Petra Atanasova (00:16:44) – And if you say follow me there and they follow you, they’re not going to follow you because you tell them to. They’re going to follow you because they want to. So what I’m doing, I’m starting my, my video and I’m saying immediately, as soon as possible that I’m a professional chef. And you can you can do that even a little bit later, but preferably preferably in the first five seconds. You need to say your authority, right? And, can we circle back to your question? Yeah. Did I answer it?

Jillian Leslie (00:17:22) – Yes, but but wait. So literally in every video you’re making, you’re going, you know, here’s the visual. And then you’re saying, I’m a professional chef.

Petra Atanasova (00:17:34) – Yes, exactly. It’s a voiceover. So I’m showing the food mostly. I have only 1 to 2 shots of meat eating most of the time and smiling at the camera. but it’s a voiceover. And immediately when the food starts, I’m saying I’m a professional chef. That’s the first thing I say.

Petra Atanasova (00:17:55) – I’m a professional chef and this is what I eat after a long day at work.

Jillian Leslie (00:18:00) – And you’re you’re saying that same thing in all the videos? Yes.

Petra Atanasova (00:18:04) – Just for those series, you can actually turn it into your brand and do it for 90% of your videos. I’ve seen people do that, but for me, I’ve also found, that it’s good to have some creative freedom and upload some other recipes that are not related to me being a chef. Maybe something that I like, something that’s in season. but for those specific series I always open with. I’m a professional chef, and lately I’ve started doing it with some newer videos. I would say it even if it’s not part of the series, but I still have to somehow relate to, me working in a kitchen. and having that expertise. Right. Got it. So say it as soon as possible in your video.

Jillian Leslie (00:18:55) – Got it. Okay. And now the next piece.

Petra Atanasova (00:19:00) – Yes, the next big piece. so I actually have something more to say about the hook.

Petra Atanasova (00:19:07) – If you don’t have an expertise, what you can do is say, start telling a story that’s going to engage the user. So one time I did, when I first met my boyfriend, he was scared of eating tofu because he thought he would get mad boobies, and that really engaged the people. They were writing comments. They were messaging me how funny it was that my boyfriend thought that some people were like, it’s actually true, men should not eat soy. And it was just a very fun way to tell a story and make the users leave comments and engage with the video. So if you can tell some kind of story, about your personal life and bring some personality, that would be just as good even if you don’t show authority. And the final thing I’ve written down is for a hook. If you don’t have anything to say, Think about what are the biggest strengths of a recipe. So maybe it’s made with two ingredients. Maybe it’s vegan because you’re made of vegan chicken pie and it’s usually not vegan, but this one is vegan and lead with the strengths of a recipe.

Petra Atanasova (00:20:25) – Maybe it’s really easy to make. It’s going to take you 20 minutes. So those are some variations of really good hooks that I’ve seen working.

Jillian Leslie (00:20:34) – Okay, I get it. And now then what?

Petra Atanasova (00:20:39) – And then it’s thinking about how to provide value. But and that’s very important. You need to remember that when people scroll on Instagram they want to relax. They want to have fun and enjoy what they’re seeing. So it’s important to not overwhelm them with so much value that they scroll to the next video. You need to show it in a way that’s, digestible and always think of a way. How can I provide the most value in the easiest and most digestible way possible? I feel like this goes without saying, but I’ve made a few videos where I would show the recipe and say every single step of the recipe, or every single thing that I thought was important, and I found that it doesn’t perform as well because, people get overwhelmed. They don’t want to hear the whole thing. They just they want actually a preview of your recipe and to get what’s most valuable from it in the least amount of time, with the least amount of effort.

Jillian Leslie (00:21:54) – So could you give me an example, give me a recipe that you did with like what your like what you’re opening shop was what you said and then what the value was that you shared. That wasn’t overwhelming.

Petra Atanasova (00:22:11) – Yeah. So about my Professional Chef series. The value I provide people is that I give them a free recipe that is approved by a chef, tested by a chef. And what I do instead of saying add basil to a blender, add tofu to a blender, I just say add all of the ingredients to a blender and toss it with your pasta until well coated or something like that. I don’t necessarily need to remind them or show all of the ingredients and tell them how to cook their pasta, for how long to boil it and stuff like that. I just make it as short as possible and as fun to watch as possible. And the value is that first, they’re getting entertainment because they’re not being bombarded with so much information. And second, they’re getting a free recipe approved by a chef.

Petra Atanasova (00:23:08) – Or in your recipe, it could be approved by someone who was vegan for five years.

Jillian Leslie (00:23:16) – If you are looking for an extra boost to grow your Instagram followers, I am talking 24 over seven. Check out our MiloTree Pop-Up app. You install it on your blog in under two minutes, and when someone visits your blog, it pops up and says, follow me on Instagram. It plays great with Google, plays great with your ad network. Join tens of thousands of other bloggers using our MiloTree Pop-Up App to grow their social media followers and email subscribers. To check it out, go to Milotree.com/popup all one word Milotree.com/popup. And now back to the show. How Bon are do you recommend your videos be? And by the way, we’re talking reals. You’re making these as reals. You’re not making these as static images. You’re not these are not stories. These are reals. So your whole strategy of growing your Instagram has been based on creating reels.

Petra Atanasova (00:24:28) – Exactly. I actually have only one post static post that I did two weeks ago.

Petra Atanasova (00:24:37) – It was a photo dump of me traveling and it was just just me sharing some of my favorite photos. It was not part of my strategy at all. So I have not posted a single, static post in those four months that I was gaining those followers.

Jillian Leslie (00:24:56) – Okay, so tell me then, how long do you shoot for or shoot for? How long are your reels? What do you like? How many seconds is a real. Yes.

Petra Atanasova (00:25:07) – So mine tend to be between 20 and 30s. I’ve actually seen other people doing just like a preview of the recipe for like 4 seconds or 5 seconds, just posting that delicious swirl of pasta or that bite into an ice cream. Those can also go viral and have a lot of views. It’s like a little preview. You don’t give much out. but mine tend to be 20 to 30s. And I’ve noticed that the longer they are, the less watch time they have. Of course, it’s harder to retain, the viewer’s attention for longer.

Jillian Leslie (00:25:53) – How many cuts? How many clips in, say, a 20 to 30 second reel?

Petra Atanasova (00:26:00) – Oh, that really depends.

Petra Atanasova (00:26:02) – I can have 30 to 40 cuts. It’s really important to make your, shots as short as possible. I’m talking 0.5 or 0.8 seconds less than a second, and you’re only putting in your video. Just the movement. As I said in the beginning, the most important part. So maybe if you lift your knife and you cut into something, the moment you want to show in the video is just the knife going through that cucumber, let’s say, and cutting into it. So we’re talking very short clips and they there can be a lot of clips, but it really depends on each recipe.

Jillian Leslie (00:26:44) – Wow. Okay. What tools are you using to create this?

Petra Atanasova (00:26:52) – I’m using cap cut. that’s pretty much. I feel my videos on my phone and I edit them on Cape Cod, and I do my voiceover on Cabot as well. It’s a great tool and I don’t use the premium version. The free version works just fine.

Jillian Leslie (00:27:10) – Wow. So you’re shooting, are you? Let’s say shooting some. Are you shooting in clips or are you shooting a long video and then cutting it up in cap cut?

Petra Atanasova (00:27:24) – Yeah, well, I’m shooting in clips, so I will shoot the first step, then stop recording the shoot the second step third, and then until the end of the video.

Petra Atanasova (00:27:34) – And I found that it’s easier and way cleaner. Cleaner this way for me. but it’s also about storage. So if you film film one very long video, it will take a lot of storage, which becomes a problem after you have 100 videos or something. so I tend to shoot just the most important part.

Jillian Leslie (00:27:58) – And then you’re up, you’re just adding them all to cap cut and then cut. What is your process in cap Cut?

Petra Atanasova (00:28:05) – Yes, I add them to cap cut. I trim them down until, as I said, the the most important movement. and then I arrange them in the way that. So my recipe starts my video, start with the finished product, then goes into me biting into the food, then goes into the recipe, and at the end you see the finished product again. And it’s very useful if you can actually do it as a loop. So like the beginning and the end are looping. This also keeps the viewer hooked and engaged. but I occasionally do this, but then I do my voiceover, I do, captions, which are very important, and I highly recommend them And I export the video.

Jillian Leslie (00:28:58) – Okay. Is there a call to action at the end in your voiceover?

Petra Atanasova (00:29:04) – So sometimes I will say comment tofu for the recipe. I don’t know if you know about many chats.

Jillian Leslie (00:29:13) – So can you explain what that is? So you will say comment and what’s the word you’re using to get the recipe?

Petra Atanasova (00:29:20) – Let’s say tofu common tofu for your recipe. It’s an automation app that, is connected to your Instagram. And the moment someone comments a specific keyword, it sends them instantly a message to their inbox. So that’s pretty much it.

Jillian Leslie (00:29:41) – Okay, so with every recipe, you’re giving it a keyword and saying comment for the recipe, comment this word for the recipe.

Petra Atanasova (00:29:49) – With with the recipes that I have, a blog post for, I will do that. for some recipes. I write them in the caption because I’ve noticed that if you write the recipe in the caption, it has more saves, which are very important for the algorithm. So sometimes I will say comment tofu for the recipe, and at the same time I will leave the ingredients.

Petra Atanasova (00:30:15) – Because this way people are commenting, but they are also saving the post. And sometimes a post can have more saves than likes, which is always a good sign.

Jillian Leslie (00:30:27) – So let’s then talk about your caption strategy. So when you say I’m leaving the ingredients in the caption, are you also are you reading leaving the entire recipe or just the ingredients?

Petra Atanasova (00:30:40) – if I have a blog post for it, I will just leave for the ingredients and I will say for the full instructions, click the link that I just sent you. And if I don’t have a blog post to direct them to because I don’t publish every single recipe that’s on my Instagram, I don’t publish it to my blog. I will leave everything in the caption.

Jillian Leslie (00:31:06) – And have you found a difference? Does one get more interaction than the other? Yes.

Petra Atanasova (00:31:11) – One one has more saves. Definitely people saving a lot more. But that doesn’t always mean that your video will go viral. In order to have a viral video, you need many moving parts. so you need, as I said, strong hook, good visual, providing value, having it being digestible.

Petra Atanasova (00:31:39) – using trending music is also very important. Yeah.

Jillian Leslie (00:31:44) – So we’ll talk about that in a second. Let’s just finish up on the caption. Are you adding keyword? Are you adding hashtags?

Petra Atanasova (00:31:52) – No. So I have not used a single caption hashtag. And that was yeah. Sorry. Hashtag. that was something that my friend told me. She was like, you don’t need to worry about hashtags. I’ve never used them, and I’ve grown just fine. And I just decided I’m not going to spend time on them. I’m going to leave them out. And it’s never been a problem for me. So I think people don’t really need hashtags.

Jillian Leslie (00:32:21) – So your call to actions are either comment tofu to get the whole recipe, which is where your mini chat will send them a link to your blog post, or you’ll say get the recipe in the caption or get just the ingredients in the caption.

Petra Atanasova (00:32:39) – Yes, or sometimes I may leave it without a call to action. I, I actually most of my viral videos, they don’t have a call to action.

Petra Atanasova (00:32:51) – It’s just that the content content is so good that people are leaving Leaving comments, saving the recipe without having necessarily a call to action.

Jillian Leslie (00:33:02) – When you, get a lot of interaction, is it because you’ve got a more controversial video, like the one about your boyfriend being worried about man boobs? Like, what gets you comments?

Petra Atanasova (00:33:21) – actually, in my Professional Chef series, the first, one of the first videos I posted, it got 16 million views. And it was very funny because one of the top comment people wrote me is, you’re not a professional chef. You’re too young to be a chef. Don’t call yourself a chef. You’re lying. And it was very interesting because I didn’t think about it necessarily just being like, oh, what will people try to comment about? But it just happened naturally. So, yeah. Does this does that answer your question?

Jillian Leslie (00:34:03) – Yes. So you didn’t even try to be controversial, but they kind of found about something to comment on. Did it hurt your feelings?

Petra Atanasova (00:34:13) – It was very hard at first because it was it was just a lot.

Petra Atanasova (00:34:18) – I wasn’t prepared for all of the views, all of the comments. I was reading every single one, and it just got to my mental health. But after some therapy and working out, I don’t feel, at all like they’re impacting me, so. Yeah. So you’re.

Jillian Leslie (00:34:34) – Not. Are you looking now for controversy? Because controversy does create engagement.

Petra Atanasova (00:34:40) – Yeah. It’s always good if you can start your hook with something controversial. That’s always, always the best.

Jillian Leslie (00:34:48) – From start to finish. How long does it take you to create one of these? 20 to 30 second reels from?

Petra Atanasova (00:35:00) – So I am filming for an hour. Let’s say if I have to get the groceries, maybe it’s an hour and a half, and then I am editing for around 45 to 30 minutes and the voiceover takes it depends, but it takes around 20 minutes. So I would say a video would take me between 2 and 3 hours to make. Okay. And that doesn’t count in, how I the idea for the video came to me in a brainstorming session.

Petra Atanasova (00:35:39) – That’s just it being made.

Jillian Leslie (00:35:42) – Do you map it out before? So let’s say you go, I’m going to do this smoothie recipe and then you go, okay, here, you know, you write down your ingredients, you go to the story, buy your ingredients. But like are you mapping out like, here’s what I want to show or you creating it on the fly.

Petra Atanasova (00:35:59) – So if it’s a smoothie recipe, I am not mapping it out because it’s pretty straightforward. But if it’s something more complex like lasagna, let’s say we have to make them the meat sauce and béchamel and putting all together. I am writing down, let’s say sauteing onions. Top view. I’m writing this down on my computer. Next step may be, adding salt front view. And I’m always. This is very important. I’m always trying to switch up the view. So not only keeping it from the top, but showing yourself, showing it from the sides. And this keeps, this keeps it interesting now.

Jillian Leslie (00:36:46) – So you start and you say I’m going to grow my Instagram.

Jillian Leslie (00:36:50) – I’m going to do three reels a week. Yes. How has that changed or not over time? How many are you doing now?

Petra Atanasova (00:37:00) – I’m still doing three reels a week. I’ve actually found this may be controversial, but you don’t need to post every day or even five times a week to grow. I have posted three times a week, sometimes even two times a week. there was even a point where I skipped for two weeks because I was just feeling overwhelmed, and I needed a break. But the most important thing is not how often you post, it’s what type of content you’re posting. So start with a minimum of a minimum of 1 to 2 times per week, and then add to it without the quality of your content going down.

Jillian Leslie (00:37:45) – How many videos have you created that have gone viral?

Petra Atanasova (00:37:50) – Gosh, I don’t know. Maybe around, it depends on what you call viral. Is it over a million views? Is it over half a million? Over a million views. I would say I have around 5 or 6, maybe seven.

Petra Atanasova (00:38:07) – And that was just enough for me to, give my account kind of this boost that I needed. And once you start gaining followers, it actually becomes easier and easier because at first, when people see all this girl has 2000 followers, they don’t have that much trust in you. But the more followers you get, the easier it becomes for people to trust you and to follow you.

Jillian Leslie (00:38:34) – That’s interesting. When you look at your analytics, what are you studying? What are you learning from?

Petra Atanasova (00:38:43) – That’s a great question. So I would usually go to my analytics to look at this is for specifically for us a specific video. So I would go into that video and I would see what is the average watch time. And let’s say if it’s around seven seconds, I will look at where is the point where in those seven seconds, what what did I do that people lost interest and stopped watching? That’s a very big thing. just looking at your also your saves. If a post doesn’t have that many saves, maybe it wasn’t as valuable to people even.

Petra Atanasova (00:39:27) – What else? Let me think. I’m also looking at, which country and which cities are my followers at in, because this is very important from brand deals. So, you know, if you have more people from the US, you’re more likely to get brand deals because, advertisers nowadays are aimed towards the US audience.

Jillian Leslie (00:39:57) – Do you feel like your videos, over time have gotten better because your studying your analytics? Or do you feel like sometimes you overthink it and almost kind of go in the wrong direction?

Petra Atanasova (00:40:12) – I kind of a little bit of both. they’ve kind of gotten better because I feel like I’ve studied the algorithm a lot more, but I also do tend to overthink it and sometimes go back to basics, because the first few viral videos I created, I was not overthinking them at all. I was just making them, putting them out and they were just becoming viral. Of course, there was a lot of strategy involved, but there wasn’t much overthinking. So I would say studying the algorithm is very important for you to get better.

Petra Atanasova (00:40:49) – Even when I’m watching, when I’m scrolling on my phone and I see a video that I really like. I will try to study it and ask myself which part did I like or which part made me? Scroll down to the next video. And to your question, it definitely is hard not to overthink, but I feel like the best videos I’ve created have just come from a place of being creative.

Jillian Leslie (00:41:16) – Do you study your competitors? Are there other vegan food bloggers? And you’re like, I will go dissect what they’re doing and be it’s not necessarily copy, but be inspired by that. I’m going to try that. Yes.

Petra Atanasova (00:41:30) – I definitely do that. actually, my series that I started about being a professional chef, I saw a few competitors do a similar video, so they were like, I’m a personal chef and this is what I eat, in LA or something, or, cooking for my client. or just. Yeah, I’m a professional chef. Here is what I eat at home after a long day at work.

Petra Atanasova (00:42:00) – And so I kind of got that inspiration from, analyzing my competitor’s content. I have to say, it wasn’t an original idea. So if you’re feeling stuck with creating content, definitely look at what your competitors are doing and what is successful for them, what is going viral and think. Analyze their videos and try to think why exactly is this going viral for them? What are people finding? What is the value they’re bringing? So yeah.

Jillian Leslie (00:42:35) – And how many videos are you started with this series? Did you only make videos in this series? Are you still only making videos in this series? Do you have multiple series? What is your recommendation?

Petra Atanasova (00:42:50) – Yeah, I have multiple series. I found that, I haven’t had found the sweet spot yet for what other kind of series to create. But what I’ve seen do better is actually, views that are not part of series. As I said, what? I’m telling a story. I don’t limit myself to series only because if I start every series with a professional chef and here’s what I make.

Petra Atanasova (00:43:22) – There’s not really much space to say anything else. So definitely sprinkle in some other videos that are standalones. I do have other series, but they haven’t picked up yet. from the algorithm.

Jillian Leslie (00:43:38) – How many have you made so far for the. I’m a professional chef.

Petra Atanasova (00:43:44) – Of maybe around 15. Something like that.

Jillian Leslie (00:43:48) – 15.

Petra Atanasova (00:43:49) – Yeah, 15 videos, which I know it’s not a lot 15 to 20, but, as I said, I feel like the strategy is so good that my least watched video from the series has 100,000 followers. sorry, 100,000 views.

Jillian Leslie (00:44:09) – At what point are you looking at your analytics? You post it 30s 30 minutes later. Are you in your analytics? Two days later? Are you in your analytics?

Petra Atanasova (00:44:21) – Yeah. So I’ve actually realized that reels, can pick up views even a week or ten days after you posted something. So I had this video that went viral, but when I first posted it, it had like 100 100 K views, which I was like, that’s okay.

Petra Atanasova (00:44:44) – You know, it’s not bad, but it’s not like 1 million. And after ten days, this video started going viral. And that’s when I realized that even if a video doesn’t seem to be performing well in the first few days, it can take up to one month for something to pick up and go viral. So I would say a minimum of one week or five days to one week is where I would start going into the analytics. And I’m even going right now for videos that were three months before.

Jillian Leslie (00:45:18) – Interesting. How do you deal emotionally when there’s a video that you think this is going to go viral and it doesn’t, do, you know, do you have a sixth sense, like are you. Right. More often than not or not?

Petra Atanasova (00:45:33) – Yeah. This is a very good question because I struggle with it a lot, to be honest. And I do tend to have a sixth sense. I just know when a video is not gonna hit as hard. Or maybe, I just, didn’t make the recipe because I felt inspired.

Petra Atanasova (00:45:55) – I just made it. Made it because I felt obligated. And those videos usually tend to not perform as well. I would say it’s very hard to not get affected when you have, for example, why sometimes perceive some of my videos as kind of flops, but I feel like the most important thing to remember is that if a video didn’t go viral the first time you posted it, you can always repost it in a few months. Give it a fresh new voice over with a different training audio and they can perform actually better than the first time you uploaded them. So never, never be. never throw out a video that didn’t perform well the first time because you never know when it’s going to go viral.

Jillian Leslie (00:46:48) – And let’s talk about trending audio. How what is like your sweet spot in terms of finding it? How many like how many times it’s been used. Like what are you looking for for trend. And then how are you doing trend audio. Can you just add it through cap cut. Like how are you adding the audio in cap cut and also have the voiceover.

Petra Atanasova (00:47:11) – Yeah. So I would I record the voiceover in cap cut and I exported with no music. And when I put my video into Instagram that’s where I select the audio I want. And my way of selecting an audio is very I don’t know, it’s just I just scroll through my feet for, let’s say I put an alarm for 20 minutes and I just scroll through my feet and I’ll try to remember the songs that I’m hearing. And if I see that, oh, I’ve heard this song five times now that shows me that it’s trending. Or if other, let’s say there are five other big accounts that I follow, and all of them have used that audio in the last two weeks. That’s a pretty good sign that it’s trending. I don’t look at how many uses an audio has, but in general, if you click on an audio and you scroll down through the reviews and most of the videos are from like, let’s say 1 million, 5 million, 10 million, that’s a pretty good sign that this audio is really picking up from the algorithm.

Petra Atanasova (00:48:33) – and it’s really trending right now. So I would consider using it if I see that there are a lot of videos, with, over a million views.

Jillian Leslie (00:48:44) – So you don’t think, oh, that’s overplayed, I need to get the audio just so it’s got, you know, just as it’s taking off.

Petra Atanasova (00:48:52) – No, I actually don’t think I don’t worry about audios being overplayed. That actually means that they’re just popular and people are like liking them and relating to the content. so if an audio has been used a lot, it depends because was it used one year ago? And back then it had like a million reels created under that audio. If it was one year ago, I’m not going to use it right now. But if it’s been trading in the last two weeks, I’m going to use it.

Jillian Leslie (00:49:29) – That’s interesting. Now, your friend who got you inspired isn’t in your niche. Was that helpful for you to learn from somebody who wasn’t a vegan food blogger? Like, do you look outside of your niche to go, okay, what are artists doing? What are beauty bloggers doing? What like what are other niches doing and how can I learn from that? Or do you tend to find food bloggers to be the best teachers for you?

Petra Atanasova (00:50:01) – Yeah, I don’t really look at other niches to be honest.

Petra Atanasova (00:50:07) – I just stick with recipes, but I feel like my friend, her knowledge of the algorithm and social media is so deep that even if she sees a video that’s completely unrelated to her niche, she’s in art and drawing. But she sees my video that’s like a recipe. She can immediately tell me what’s wrong with it, why it didn’t perform, or why did perform? And, maybe, if she has a better hook, she would tell me, like, oh, you know, this hook could have been a better way to get people engaged. but I don’t generally look at people outside of my niche, niche, niche. I don’t know how to pronounce either.

Jillian Leslie (00:50:54) – Yes, people have debates over that. You could probably create a hook and get people to engage on what the right way is to say that word. Yeah, true. Now you decided to grow your Instagram following in order to monetize Instagram because as you’re watching your page views drop, you’re like, I’ve got to find a new way to make money.

Jillian Leslie (00:51:19) – How has that been for you? How are you monetizing Instagram? I think people think that if you have $100,000, 100,000 followers, you’re making $100,000. And it’s not simple like that. So explain to me your thought process of how you go from now. I’ve got these followers now, how do I make money?

Petra Atanasova (00:51:42) – Yeah, it doesn’t work like that, as you said. But right now I’m creating an e-book, actually, that’s going to be full of recipes, and I’m going to promote it through my successful series of what it is, a professional chef. Because the thing about those series is that all of the recipes require no chopping, which was something that people really liked. And I’ve had even disabled people that have messaged me and were like, it’s really useful when I don’t have to chop anything. It’s kind of like my own niche that I’ve created, and that book is gonna be all about no chop recipes, and I’m going to promote it through my Professional Chef series.

Jillian Leslie (00:52:28) – Milo Tree Cart would be perfect for this as the easiest way to sell this.

Jillian Leslie (00:52:34) – Are you collecting email addresses from all these followers?

Petra Atanasova (00:52:42) – I’m trying to, but my current strategy is not the best. I definitely think I should look into my old tree. I’m with Mailer Lite right now. I don’t have I have, a thousand email subscribers or something like that, which I know is low for the kind of followers and pageviews that I have.

Jillian Leslie (00:53:04) – Yes.

Petra Atanasova (00:53:04) – So definitely something that I should look into. Yes.

Jillian Leslie (00:53:07) – So again, we are rolling out Milo Tree Leeds that integrates effortlessly with Mailer Lite. But this way you can put together, say, your top five recipes, your no chop recipes let’s say. Or just do a teaser and say, hey, to get this go, you know, here’s the link and you’ll be able to your people will be able to put their name and their email address in, and then you’ve uploaded it to my low tree cart, and then we deliver it directly to your new email subscribers. Plus, you can sell something on the back end like it’s such a win win.

Jillian Leslie (00:53:48) – But for you, as I’m listening to you, I’m so impressed with what you’ve done and you’ve taught me so much. And I want to say, get those 100,000. How many followers do you have right now?

Petra Atanasova (00:54:01) – 120.

Jillian Leslie (00:54:02) – Okay, get those 120 followers and get them on your email list. Because on Instagram they’re there right now. But if you can push them over to your email list, you own them and it will help you with your SEO, with your authority for your blog, you’ll be able to sell stuff to them. And the one thing that you said that made me again, I get, you know, I hear stuff and then there’s like a ding, ding, ding that goes off in my brain, which is just how your friend can look at your Instagram and give you those comments saying, hey, if you changed your hook to this, I bet you’d get better, a better response, or hey, if you you know, here’s where I can tell people are dropping off.

Jillian Leslie (00:54:47) – It’s like if you can say to people, I, I will consult and you can hire me and we, I will do an audit of your Instagram and I will give you pointers. I will go through your Instagram. I will tell you how you could have improved these reels, give you ideas for five reels with the hooks you could sell that like that is something people will pay you for because you’ve got those eyes.

Petra Atanasova (00:55:19) – That’s a great idea.

Jillian Leslie (00:55:21) – Like I would go I could turn that on right now, you know, and and like, just like, say, hey, reach out to me. We could do this. And then you could set that up in my luxury cart literally in four minutes.

Petra Atanasova (00:55:37) – That would be amazing. I’m definitely going to do that.

Jillian Leslie (00:55:40) – Only because.

Petra Atanasova (00:55:41) – As.

Jillian Leslie (00:55:42) – You’re talking to me, like there are so many things that you have shared with me that I’m like, okay, this is what I’m going to do. Because I was posting on Instagram, got burnt out, was working on MiloTree and MiloTreeCart and Leads and all this stuff and said, okay, I’ll come back and now I’m ready to come back.

Jillian Leslie (00:56:02) – But you’ve given me so many things that I’m dying to try. I found this conversation so fascinating and useful, but like, I’m going, you gotta be selling this.

Petra Atanasova (00:56:17) – Yeah, totally. Okay, so I’m totally gonna do this.

Jillian Leslie (00:56:21) – So tell me. So you’re gonna. You’re working on an e-book. How have you been working. Working, reaching out to brands, for example.

Petra Atanasova (00:56:30) – So since, this month. June, actually, it’s July now, but since last month, I have a, social media manager, kind of like a representer. And she’s going to connect me with brands and, a negotiate for me, which is very important. I try to do it myself. And I just found out that I’m not good at it. I’m kind of wasting my time because I could be creating content in the meantime. So for me, it was better to hire out someone, give them a percentage of what I make. But for them to negotiate everything and for me to just create the content.

Petra Atanasova (00:57:12) – So that’s what’s been happening. And I actually do have a few brand partnerships lined up, which is really exciting.

Jillian Leslie (00:57:21) – That’s so. Well. well. And did you listen to my episode with Anka, where I’ll put it in the show notes, where she is creating video for brands and is like it, like learning from her on how she’s done. It is so. And she doesn’t have a big following.

Petra Atanasova (00:57:43) – Yeah. Oh that’s amazing. I definitely need to check it.

Jillian Leslie (00:57:47) – I will, I will make sure to send you that episode. So there are a variety of ways to monetize what you’ve grown. But please get those people on your email list because you own them. You own the nothing. You own the people, but you own the relationship.

Speaker 3 (00:58:05) – Yeah.

Jillian Leslie (00:58:06) – Now what? Just briefly, what is your strategy with stories or other parts of Instagram? Are you having conversations in DMs with people? What for you? Are the other areas of Instagram that are working for you?

Petra Atanasova (00:58:23) – So definitely when someone DMs me and they’re like, hey, my recipe turned out well or sometimes is, it didn’t turn out well.

Petra Atanasova (00:58:32) – I’m always having a conversation with them, asking them if they enjoyed it or if they shared it with friends. how was it making it if it was easy for them? Just striking a conversation just to know that they can trust me. And anytime they messaged me, I’m there for them and building that relationship. So that’s very important. I try to answer most of the people who messaged me, which is time consuming, but it’s definitely worth it. And for stories I do try to post every day, and I found that the more personal my stories are, the better I connect with people and the more they reply to me and message me and go to my account, scroll through my feed. So because I don’t share personal content on my feet, I keep it for the stories and I would definitely recommend don’t get burned out with it. You don’t need to post every day if you can’t, but posting a few times a week and maybe sharing some personal stuff that you’re comfortable with. I actually my most watched story was, when I felt like I didn’t know what I was doing with my life, and I share that on Instagram.

Petra Atanasova (00:59:52) – And there were so many people who reached out and were like, oh my God, I feel the same. And it was just a really nice way to get personal with them. And

Speaker 3 (01:00:04) – Yeah.

Jillian Leslie (01:00:06) – So typically just let’s say every day, one story, multiple stories, will it be like I’m at the grocery store? Will it be, I’m taking a vacation? What kinds of just what have you feel like? You’ve got nothing to share. What are you sharing?

Petra Atanasova (01:00:21) – If I have nothing to share out, I usually do behind the scenes because it’s easier for me. I would just, take a picture of me shooting a recipe and say it’s coming soon or something like that. And, if I don’t have something to share, I would, usually just. I did that a few weeks ago and it worked out really well. I post some other content and I’m like, guys, if you’re looking for a really quick 30 minute dinner tonight, make this recipe. It’s an older one, but it’s a keeper.

Petra Atanasova (01:01:00) – And this way I’m posting my old, old content, but repurposing it for stories.

Jillian Leslie (01:01:07) – That’s very smart. Very smart. One last question. How do you deal with burnout?

Petra Atanasova (01:01:15) – it’s very tough. What I found that works is to batch film, which is not a new thing, people. I’ve heard people talk about it, but have one day a week where a few all of the three videos that I make, and also plan ahead, that’s really helped me to just know that, okay, I’ve got the content for 2 to 3 weeks ahead, and if I feel burned out, I can take a break without my content being affected. So planning ahead is really important and then just taking a break if you feel overwhelmed. I felt overwhelmed in May and I took a two week break and it did not affect me at all. I actually had a video go viral after that. So definitely don’t be too hard on yourself. And if you’re finding that you’re burned out because you can’t post as many times a week as you want it to, maybe lower that and see how it goes for you, it really just you need to be consistent.

Petra Atanasova (01:02:20) – It doesn’t matter if you’re posting 3 or 5 times a week, as long as you do it every week, and people know to expect your content is going to be fine.

Jillian Leslie (01:02:29) – That’s great. All right.

Speaker 3 (01:02:31) – Petra.

Jillian Leslie (01:02:32) – If people want to see what you’re doing and want to reach out to you and want to hire you so that you will evaluate their Instagram, where should they go?

Petra Atanasova (01:02:44) – so my Instagram is the best way to reach me. It’s sun glow kitchen.

Jillian Leslie (01:02:50) – So wait, so say it again.

Petra Atanasova (01:02:51) – Sun glow kitchen. The best way to reach me. My DMs are always open, and I’m definitely thinking of making some kind of course or book about how to grow your Instagram, in the future. So if you’re interested, send me a DM. I if you have any questions or want me to give you some advice, I would love to do that.

Jillian Leslie (01:03:13) – Well, I have to say, you’ve shared so much great stuff you’ve re-inspired me, so thank you for that. And I’ve loved this conversation and I look forward to watching your journey.

Jillian Leslie (01:03:24) – So thank you so much, Petra, for coming on the show.

Petra Atanasova (01:03:29) – Thank you for inviting me. It was a pleasure chatting with you.

Jillian Leslie (01:03:32) – I hope you guys like this episode with Petra. For me, my biggest takeaway is that it’s not as complicated as I think it is that Petra really broke down so many strategies that I can implement, and I will be implementing because I have found Instagram over time to be very frustrating, as if it’s a puzzle I cannot solve. So I will be taking many of her tips with me in my own reels. I probably will not spend as much time as she does creating them, but maybe I can add things like quick cuts and movement and a voiceover. So if you want to follow me on Instagram, please do and you can watch what I’m doing, which is good because it will make me more accountable. You can follow me at milotree super easy and if you reach out to me, I’ll follow you and tell me what your account is. I will happily follow you back if you want to get on a free 20 minute zoom, call with me to talk about your digital product strategy.

Jillian Leslie (01:04:42) – This is going away, by the way. I am going to be phasing out these calls. So if you’re interested in getting fresh eyes on your business, go to milotree.com. You’ll see a link to my calendar book, a time I’d love to help reinvigorate you. And if you think this episode is useful, please share it with a friend. If you are liking the podcast, please give it five stars on iTunes. I would be so appreciative and I will see you here again next week.