Listen to this episode with Adam Riemer, email expert, about interesting ways to target your email list through ads on Google, Facebook, and Pinterest, to grow your business.
Did you know there’s power in your email list beyond sending them emails?
That right. You can target your list by sending them ads using the data they’ve already provided you. And you don’t even have to send them emails.
We talk about targeting people with specific opt-ins, how to deal with a cold email list, how to set up sales funnels based on your customers’ needs, and so much more.
Listen to this episode to understand how to grow your business by using your email list in a whole new way! This definitely opened my eyes.
Table of Contents
- MiloTree BlogStart
- Adam Riemer
- Slade Cutter lawyer
- Jaime Hawke lawyer
- The Blogger Genius Podcast on iTunes
Subscribe to The Blogger Genius Podcast:
Welcome to the Blogger Genius Podcast brought to you by MiloTree. Here’s your host, Jillian Leslie.
Jillian Leslie 0:11
Hello, everyone. Welcome back to the show. I hope you are doing well in these uncertain times. Before I get started, I wanted to speak to those of you who are listening to the podcast, who are ready to start their businesses but they haven’t yet because they have not set up a WordPress blog yet.
Start a WordPress Blog Easily with MiloTree BlogStart
As what I like to call the “hub” of their business so that they can build the spokes off of it. Now David and I talk about this all the time, technology is tricky, and having somebody help you who understands it is a really good thing.
Therefore we would love to help you set up your WordPress blog. And not only will we set it up, we will optimize it. We will install the plugins that you need and we will explain everything to you and we’ll be there for any technical questions you have.
Honestly, I really highly recommend this to anybody who’s ready to get started. To learn more, head to milotree.com/blogstart. And again, that’s milotree.com/blogstart. If you have any questions about this, please reach out to me at firstname.lastname@example.org.
Our goal is to put more online entrepreneurs out there in the world. This is a perfect time to take your fate into your own hands and we really want to support you.
So for today’s episode, I have Adam Reimer on the show and he is an email marketing expert.
As you’ll learn I was at a conference, I met him and he had some really interesting strategies around email marketing and when I heard him, I said, “Oh my God, please come on the show.” I think you are going to think about your list very differently after listening to this episode.
So without further delay, here is my interview with Adam Riemer. Adam, I am very excited to have you here and to pick your brain about email marketing.
Adam Riemer 2:24
Oh, thanks for having me.
Interesting Ways to Target Your Email List
Jillian Leslie 2:25
We met at Pubcon, which is a conference I’d never heard of. And then I saw that it was going to be in Austin. And then I was in Austin. Now I live here and I just happen to come into your session, email marketing session, just as you were about to talk.
And you started talking and I thought to myself, I’ve got to interview this guy for my show.
Adam Riemer 2:46
Jillian Leslie 2:47
And the reason why you piqued my interest was because you showed a slide and you said something like, I’m this email marketing guy. This is what I do and ready? You said I don’t send emails to my list. Right then I had like one of those, like a brain explosion. Like what? What are you talking about?
So first of all, before we launch into that, will you give me a little bit of your background and how you got interested in online marketing, especially email?
Adam Riemer 3:21
Yes. I was actually filling in for someone else who canceled on the email session, because I have helped people with their email marketing for years. I think my first email presentation was close to 10 years ago.
Jillian Leslie 3:33
Adam Riemer 3:33
And I started in digital marketing unofficially in the 90s when I was putting up websites and looking for traffic for like, like posts and other engines. And professionally in 2001 or 2003, somewhere around there. And everything just kind of led from SEO and affiliate into other channels.
Because with the affiliate marketing world, I had to come across emailers and spam-can compliance, oh my gosh, I can’t talk today CAN-SPAM compliance as well as how to monetize them how to segment the list.
And then with the company I was working for at the time, I was in charge of their email program, as well as their Pay-per-click, and their SEO and their affiliate program. It was a smaller company. So I had to learn fast. And I really liked the way that he can split test things.
How Email Marketing Let’s You Get Granular in Targeting
At that point, it was one of the few channels where you can really track everything we had clicked on for the website. But email was a place where I could really get granular with links and how people were interacting and engaging with the actual piece of content that we had created. That’s what I loved about it
Jillian Leslie 4:40
So wait, okay, so you’re talking about links within email?
Adam Riemer 4:44
Jillian Leslie 4:44
You could see what people were clicking on and how people then were interacting let’s say on the website that it sent people to you.
Adam Riemer 4:52
Everything in between so Clicktale was tracking the website. And then you could use parameters at that point, I think.
Jillian Leslie 4:59
Adam Riemer 4:59
No, this was even possibly pre Urchin which became Google Analytics.
Jillian Leslie 5:06
Adam Riemer 5:06
Yeah, we just we had a bunch of different tools and things that we could do at the time. And it was really fun and really neat.
Jillian Leslie 5:13
Really, okay, and what were you like in the beginning? What were cool things that you could see people doing?
Adam Riemer 5:18
Hovering and clicking and bouncing and engaging with two or three different links or pieces of content or topics, but not others and skipping things. So I could really start to figure out who was going to do what and when.
Jillian Leslie 5:32
Adam Riemer 5:33
Then I could pay attention. I can segment the database and email specific topics and specific calls to action to build a funnel much easier.
Jillian Leslie 5:40
So is it this idea that you want to figure out how to get the right message in front of the right person, but at the right time, like those three things seem hard to triangulate,
Adam Riemer 5:52
Not really, it’s just using data?
Jillian Leslie 5:55
Adam Riemer 5:55
The job of every marketer.
Why You Don’t Need to Send Emails to Your List
Jillian Leslie 5:57
Okay. Yes, absolutely. Alright, so let’s talk about that. When you said this thing about email is really powerful and you’re not sending emails to your list, what do you mean by that?
Adam Riemer 6:13
So, we were laughing at the show, I tend to be incredibly anti-social where I just like to be in my own world. And when I send an email, I always get people writing back to me. And I love hearing from people that subscribe and they read my site.
But also I get so nervous to respond and to write back and I read all of them, but I get nervous. So I was like, how can I get in front of my audience again, without having to open up that line of communication, especially when I’m just completely swamped like during the holidays?
Jillian Leslie 6:45
Sorry, when you’re what?
Adam Riemer 6:47
Completely swamped, like during Q4 Holiday Promotions, or when I’m about to go on vacation and I’m not going to have my computer. How can I prevent a couple hundred emails from coming in?
Jillian Leslie 6:59
Adam Riemer 6:59
That I’m going to feel like obligated to respond to.
Jillian Leslie 7:02
Right and people are asking of you in those emails?
Adam Riemer 7:04
Yeah. And I don’t charge anything for my blog or my email newsletters. I rarely send them anymore, but they’re free. So it’s like, I’m not being paid. I’m doing this. I want to give back to the community, community as a marketing community.
Jillian Leslie 7:19
Adam Riemer 7:20
It’s just a way I can get back so it gets annoying when people start making demands still. There are other ways that I can still reach them and still provide some value to them without having to open up that time suck.
Jillian Leslie 7:20
Okay, so tell me what this secret process is all about.
Adam Riemer 7:39
There really isn’t any I just I look for where I can use an email list. So some of the major platforms are Facebook, Pinterest, and Google. Bing is opening theirs up shortly as we found out.
Jillian Leslie 7:51
Adam Riemer 7:52
You can go there and then you can start using their targeting and their triggers and their different features to really narrow down your audience, so if you have your database set up so that you know XYZ people like affiliate marketing, and these people like cooking and these people like cats, for example.
You just upload those email addresses, and then you can narrow it down, I only want to show it to the subscribers here that enjoy cats and the color blue and maybe live in the western part of the United States.
Well, now I can do that because and if my articles written specifically for that demographic, I can show it that way. But the same can be applied for anything for products or for region. If you need to help a sales rep out in the West Coast, you can do the same thing and you can narrow your list down.
There’s a lot of different things you can do with it.
Jillian Leslie 8:47
Okay, so let’s, let’s break this down. Let’s say, I use ConvertKit as my CRM, let’s say that’s my level as a blogger. So what I’m doing is I’m putting up some lead magnets on my site. Let’s say I’m a lifestyle blogger. So I do travel and food and family.
And so therefore, if somebody comes to my site on a recipe, I have a lead magnet, boom, they download it, and they get placed on my list, but I tagged them, food, or recipes. And so then what I can do is go into ConvertKit, download those email subscribers that live in the south.
I don’t know if I would have that information. But let’s say I know they’re interested in food. I have that list. And then I can upload that list, let’s say to Pinterest where I do a lot of food stuff. And I can then target those people with my cookbook.
How to Target People on Your List Using Ads
Adam Riemer 9:50
Yeah, you can even take it 10 levels deeper. You can go there and you can take anyone who signed up off of your recipe if it was kids recipes versus meat recipes versus organic or vegan or paleo recipes, you can now go in and so let’s just pretend it was kids recipes or kid friendly recipes.
What you can do now is you can take the next generation book, and you could upload and start showing ads to sell those or you can use a lead magnet where you would show part of a recipe and saying here’s how to take it three levels deeper or get the full download here for like $2 or $5 or whatever you want to charge.
And you can resell or you can sit there and if you want to say okay, these are parents because they’re looking for kid friendly recipes, why not take it and see if they also like crafting and say you took our recipes guide three weeks ago. I just wanted to see if you’re also interested in crafting for Valentine’s Day.
Jillian Leslie 10:49
Where am I messaging them that?
Adam Riemer 10:51
With the ads so once you upload your email address or email list to one of those platforms when you show the ads for something complimentary or In next generation, so if you had a photography guide on your list for example.
I know a lot of lifestyle bloggers do sell photos and do have step by step on how to shoot or keep a memory with your iPhone, for example,
Jillian Leslie 11:13
Adam Riemer 11:14
Basically, if you teach a technique or how to use portrait mode, well, there’s always going to be an advanced level too. So if you gave them that one, or they bought it from you, and now the new iPhones out. Why don’t you upsell or cross-sell, if you purchase this it’s like cats attacking the computer say.
Jillian Leslie 11:35
Adam Riemer 11:36
But basically what you can do is you can take the next generation guide or next level course or complimentary one, like maybe how to shoot portraits in black and white and do the lighting with your iPhone. Or if you already know their phone model or you know what they’re interested in.
So you can cross-sell the next generation guide and make some money off of it.
Jillian Leslie 11:53
Got it. So I target those specific people that I have tagged on my end up-load their email addresses. So could be a small number of people. But then I can make sure that my stuff is in front of them because I know they have an iPhone.
Adam Riemer 12:10
Jillian Leslie 12:10
I know they have an iPhone that has portrait mode. So it’s an at least an iPhone 10.
Adam Riemer 12:15
Yes, and they have an interest in learning how to take better photos. So that’s a really important factor is that they have some sort of interest in photography, or they are taking photos for a reason.
Jillian Leslie 12:28
Adam Riemer 12:28
Whether memories are to sell prints, and then that’s where it gets really interesting because you can set up affinity groups also likes Fuji Film, also likes Canon, or Leica, whatever that camera company’s name is. You can always put these on your computer and you can start to test.
Jillian Leslie 12:44
And what platforms in terms of their ad targeting do you like the best?
Adam Riemer 12:49
It depends on the goal and the product. So you mentioned Pinterest earlier.
How to Target People on Pinterest with Ads
Jillian Leslie 12:54
Yes, my users use Pinterest a lot.
Adam Riemer 12:57
Pinterest is fantastic.
Jillian Leslie 12:59
Okay, so aspiration for Pinterest. What about Facebook?
Adam Riemer 13:02
Facebook just gives you a lot of different demographics but it changes regularly. So anyone in real estate basically just lost all of their targeting no matter what and some you just lost their ability to upload a list. I believe there was a lawsuit by HUD that they lost.
Jillian Leslie 13:21
Adam Riemer 13:21
So it’s just really going to depend on your niche. Google’s a fantastic one because you can break down by median income, demographics, zip codes; it also feeds into YouTube so you can show over specific channels or UpKeeps works.
It’s really going to depend on the focus of the campaign, but it works for all types of bloggers from entrepreneurial bloggers and how to make money online to recipes travel lifestyle, I was working with a sex dungeon blogger.
Jillian Leslie 13:49
Sorry, say that again.
Adam Riemer 13:50
A sex dungeon blogger.
Jillian Leslie 13:51
A sex dungeon blogger?
Adam Riemer 13:52
Yes. She works on some of my what’s it called? In my lingerie affiliate programs.
Jillian Leslie 13:57
Adam Riemer 13:58
She provides a clean and safe place for couples that want to experience a different thing.
Jillian Leslie 14:05
Adam Riemer 14:05
And so she provides safe how to tutorials, tutorials and guides for bondage and S&M and how not to hurt yourself how to create a safe environment.
Jillian Leslie 14:17
Got it. Okay.
Adam Riemer 14:18
It’s not as bad as it sounds, there’s nothing —
Jillian Leslie 14:20
I know. I like it. I like it. I think my audience would like to hear this.
Adam Riemer 14:24
There are strategies you can use literally across the board. I was working with a special needs autism blogger doing the same type of thing not the same type of thing but the same strategy. I can use the platform that way to help the parents of the kids not target the kids directly.
Jillian Leslie 14:42
Let’s go back to the to the bondage women. That’s a little more interesting, a little more titillating. Can you explain like break down her funnel? What does it look like?
Adam Riemer 14:51
So that I can’t because it’s going to be easy to track her down if I do.
Jillian Leslie 14:57
Okay, let’s do autism or give me a random situation.
Adam Riemer 15:03
If you want to pick a product or an issue or a goal, then I could create it that way.
Jillian Leslie 15:07
Okay, so I, how about I sell Special Needs eBooks?
Adam Riemer 15:14
Jillian Leslie 15:16
Adam Riemer 15:18
Okay. Do you want to use your email list or just want to talk about how to target down?
How to Target Your Audience Using an eBook
Jillian Leslie 15:22
Well, let’s start with my email list. So what I do is I have a freebie on my site. And it’s a guide to calming my child with ADHD. These are 10 tips.
Adam Riemer 15:35
Jillian Leslie 15:37
And let’s say then I have a course that I want to sell.
Adam Riemer 15:44
Okay, cool. So there’s two different options you can try here, one if they’re already on your email list and you know they’ve been engaging with you, it’s going to be a pretty easy sell because they like your content.
If there’s someone new on the list, I may want to test to figure out what the best approach is. So I may try another email list or I may advertise different blog posts and articles to them. And by that, I mean maybe there’s something about helping ADHD with a fidget, helping ADHD. I’m not a medical doctor or anything.
So I’m making this up off the top my head.
Jillian Leslie 16:15
Adam Riemer 16:16
With sensory friendly clothing or sending your kid to having the teacher or how to talk to your teacher about providing weighted vests and weighted pads so that your daughter can sit at her desk more calmly and easily. And then from there, I would sit there and I’d say, Okay, which one are these people are interacting with.
And I would set those up as custom audiences in Facebook or I would look at which ones they’re clicking through for my email tool, if I sent an email, and now I know the right way to lead them into the course.
If I have a course about weighted products, and I have a course about fidget products and I have a course about, what is the first one? Whatever that was.
Jillian Leslie 16:58
Let’s say essential oils to calm my kids.
Adam Riemer 17:07
And so basically what we would do then is I would phrase the wording in the ad around the course so that we upload the list for which ad set. Now I bring them into the course and so I know what they are interested in most.
And I’m going to feature. Would you like to learn how to control ADHD using essential oils? We also cover fidgets and weighted products.
Jillian Leslie 17:28
I love this.
How to Create a Sales Funnel Based on Your Customers’ Needs
Adam Riemer 17:29
And so the funnel is based on their wants and needs. And the best part is you’re able to promote products and you could get sponsors from there.
So if you get 100 people ready for the course. There’s no reason you can’t reach out to an essential oils user or a weighted blanket company or fidget company or behavioral therapists if it’s targeted geo.
Jillian Leslie 17:53
Adam Riemer 17:54
And now you can get sponsors to pay for it all so you can make money. There’s just so many different things you can do. You can also follow up with affiliate links for all the products feature.
Jillian Leslie 18:05
Right. But what I like about what you’re saying is, there are lots of different parents with kids with ADHD. And each one is somewhat different or there could be buckets. So there are the ones who love essential oils and want that as a strategy.
There are the other ones who want the weighted blankets and find that their kid responds to that. But what I love is you are targeting that message you’re targeting both of them to join my course.
But you’re doing it in this very granular way of saying, I know you’re not responding to essential oils, but you’re responding to weighted blanket. So I’m going to talk about weighted blankets as a way to get you into my course and I’m going to talk to you about essential oils to get you into my course.
Adam Riemer 18:55
Yeah, and even though the course covers all three topics, we’re focusing the first on what they were most interested in and because they were on your blog from the ad using your email list, they already trust you a little more. One, they’ve already subscribed.
Two, they’ve been to your blog at least twice. Now the first time to subscribe the second time to read your article. So if they’re clicking a third time, they’re familiar with your brand, and they trust you. And now they can actually ask questions from you about the article they just read.
And they can learn two more strategies.
Jillian Leslie 19:29
Sorry say that last thing again.
Adam Riemer 19:32
Sorry. And they can now learn two more strategies that may or may not work for their children, but at least it’s more arsenal of ways to help their children.
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How Specific Should Your Email Opt-In Be?
Jillian Leslie 21:43
So do you recommend that on each of your blog posts having a very specific opt-in or do you recommend a more general opt in we’re going to talk about ADHD or we’re going to talk about the 10 best essential oils for ADHD on the essential oil page post.
Adam Riemer 22:02
I would recommend going as granular as you can without going overboard. So the categories on your blog if you have four blog categories, we’ll just call them ABC and D, you can have a message for your opt-in box on all posts within Category A, it’s relevant to it.
So if that’s essential oils, learn more about essential oils and how they can help your children succeed. If he has weighted products you may want to say looking for weighted products deals as well as unique strategies and ways to use them. Here’s how you join our newsletter for more information.
And now you have a targeted message and your database is more targeted which divided up.
Jillian Leslie 22:41
Got it because I think even I fall into this which is I have general opt-ins, but I’m not thinking as granularly.
Adam Riemer 22:50
You can normally find a way to track the approach that they opted in from as well.
What to Do With a Cold Email List?
Jillian Leslie 22:57
Let’s elevate up a little bit. Like what if I have an email list and it’s cold. And I haven’t really been very consistent in emailing my list or thinking strategically about this. Do you feel like there’s any value in a cold email list?
Adam Riemer 23:14
Absolutely. Because even if they don’t open their emails, if that’s the email they use to sign up for Facebook, that’s where your ads are going to show.
Unknown Speaker 23:23
Whoo, okay. So what about this idea then, of calling your list?
Adam Riemer 23:29
So I highly recommend you always call but if you’re not really getting a response from that, and you’re like, I know these people are there. You can always say Hey, if you know that they opted in because of a guide you wrote five years ago, and then you like just went silent for the last three years.
You can write a new guide and then advertise that guide. If it was for someone pregnant, who was having the baby that year. They have a five year old child. So think about five year old issues or five year old party ideas. Or something that a parent of a five year old is going to want or need.
Now create the next level guide, which is that and see if they’d like to hop back in. And that’s a way to grow your list and find your actives instead of just deleting someone who could be a new potential customer.
Jillian Leslie 24:15
So you’re saying email them.
Adam Riemer 24:17
No. Run your ads for the new guides to come back and download it. And now you know who’s downloaded and you have a list again.
Jillian Leslie 24:25
Adam Riemer 24:25
Because babies grow. Obviously. Sorry.
Jillian Leslie 24:26
But it is true. And their needs change.
Adam Riemer 24:35
So like, someone who just had a baby but not having more, they don’t care about what strollers going to be there for a new born. And this is a good way to continue to grow your list.
Jillian Leslie 24:47
Got it? Okay. So what you would do I have a cold list. You’re right. I somebody signed up five years ago. I haven’t emailed my list in three years. I upload my email list to what platform would you recommend if I want to re-engage them with an ad?
Adam Riemer 25:01
All of them.
Jillian Leslie 25:01
Or free download? All of them.
Adam Riemer 25:04
Some are going to be better than others. But there’s no reason you can’t show an ad across. If your goal is to figure out what’s going to be live and who’s still interested in your type of brand and your type of products, why not just go for the mass reach?
Jillian Leslie 25:19
Okay, so I go for mass reach, and I see which of these. Now do I care if they know who I am? Like, they don’t remember they signed up for my list five years ago, does that matter?
Adam Riemer 25:28
You’d be amazed how good people’s memories are sometimes, but no, it doesn’t really matter. Some of the platforms do ask that you verify they are active customers. So you are going to run into a potential risk there.
Jillian Leslie 25:41
Adam Riemer 25:42
But they can change those rules at any time. So I don’t want to say any one of them in particular.
Jillian Leslie 25:46
Now, can I do this cost effectively? I’m a blogger. I’m a one woman operation. And you’re telling me go run ads on Google and Facebook and Pinterest like how do I make that work for me?
Adam Riemer 26:00
It’s not expensive on Facebook, you can show ads to your list for pennies on the dollar.
Jillian Leslie 26:05
Adam Riemer 26:06
Jillian Leslie 26:06
Okay. So these aren’t like conversions?
Adam Riemer 26:09
These are $5 ads. Run it from Monday to Friday and just run $5. $1 a day.
Jillian Leslie 26:14
And do you think I would reach a fair number of people?
Adam Riemer 26:17
Depends on your list size and how many of them use that email address for their Facebook accounts.
Jillian Leslie 26:22
And these are like awareness campaigns?
Adam Riemer 26:25
Yes. So you’re just seeing who’s still active if the email addresses are being used. If these people are on Facebook, you may find out none of them use Facebook. Instead, they just use Pinterest.
Jillian Leslie 26:36
Adam Riemer 26:37
Say you were following me, you’re going to have a Pinterest following and a Pinterest audience.
Jillian Leslie 26:42
Absolutely. So you only have to go in because again, I hear lots of different things, which is if you want to do ads, you need to test and you need to spend money to test so you have to assume that you’re going to be in the hole for a while until you start learning.
Adam Riemer 27:03
Well, if we’re just talking about old lists and trying to get people to reactivate on the list just to see who’s active or not, then you’re guaranteed a loss because you’re not trying to sell anything or make money off of it again. So figure out what you’re willing to lose.
Jillian Leslie 27:18
Okay, but you’re saying though, that each re-engagement you’re not going to be spending $6 to get that customer back or to get that email subscriber back.
Adam Riemer 27:29
It depends how good you are at advertising. It depends on your ad copy, your images, if you still resonate with them. Everybody’s different. Some people are great with ad copy and imagery. Some people are not some people know how to reach their audience. Some people think they do. And some people just can’t.
How Long Should Your Emails Be?
Jillian Leslie 27:50
Yep. Now let’s talk about when you are crafting an email. Okay, and I know you don’t like writing them but they’re these different schools of thought one is that it needs to be personalized, like, Hi, Jill, you know, blah, blah, blah like that’s very important.
Another thing is you don’t want to have multiple links in your email because you want say, one call of action. So what are your thoughts on that as we start there?
Adam Riemer 28:18
I think one link in your email alone is probably one of the worst issue you can find. You’re making it–
Jillian Leslie 28:23
Ooh, tell me.
Adam Riemer 28:24
–user friendly. So I do things two different ways. If I’m doing mass appeal, and it’s not something I would want someone to actually really pay close attention to. I’m just going to say, “Hi everyone.” or “Hello beautiful.” or “What’s up y’all.” Something like that.
If I want this subscriber to feel like this is a personal message or something more important, I do the first name because it does tend to get more open rates. But it’s also likes to be affiliates in my programs know that if their first names in there. This is something that I feel a little more strongly about.
And I’m going to change the wording from, “Thank you all for doing this.” to “Thank you for doing this.” So the wordings may be different as well. And that has an impact and a lot of people forget that. Like, they’ll say, “Hi, first name, all of our affiliate partners are doing this.” And obviously that makes no sense.
Or all of you recipe lovers. And it’s like, you just said,” Hi, first name.” So why don’t you write to me directly instead of Hello subscribers, or if you have a branded name for your followers? So that’s an important part about the comment about the one link.
Jillian Leslie 29:29
Adam Riemer 29:30
I just did this with a client. I was like you mentioned XY and Z in the beginning. I’ll just say party planning, recipe planning and meal planning are maybe your top three things you’re providing. And this is in their responder, once you opt in.
They mentioned all three of those things, but don’t link to them for similar reason to what you just said. Like you just said, you have all these available. Why don’t you want these people to go to those tools, download your app and download these and engage with it.
If you’re mentioning it, because it’s your service. Help the subscriber find it. That’s just user experience.
Jillian Leslie 30:05
Now what if I’m selling? Let’s say, Okay, I say, yeah, I’ve got meal plans. And I’ve got this and I’ve got that. But I really want to sell this one thing. Is that a distraction?
Adam Riemer 30:16
Anything not related to the seller pre-selling it or giving a reason to purchase is a distraction and shouldn’t be there.
Jillian Leslie 30:23
Adam Riemer 30:24
But if it’s going to add to the experience, if you’re like, are you looking for the specs on what it’s compatible to. Take it to a specs page that’s directly relevant to it for the product, and then put them into your funnel where they can purchase from that page?
Jillian Leslie 30:37
Adam Riemer 30:38
If you want to sell a product, make it about that product and the benefits of that end user. And if there’s questions that come up regularly, like I just said, with compatibility include that in and provide a resource to help reassure them it’s the right one.
Jillian Leslie 30:52
Interesting. So my husband is my partner and he always feels like the more fields you ask, they’re like, it’s like doors you have to pass through and you’re always going to lose people in that process. So his instinct is not to ask for somebody say first name because you will get fewer signups and what is your feeling about that?
How Many Fields to Ask For in Your Opt-In?
Adam Riemer 31:21
So for the opt-in box, I always want first name, last name and email. Anything else for me is optional. Yeah, people don’t want to fill it out. But you can make it a lot more personal and a lot more engaging.
And I like to know who people are. Given them a valid reason to contact you first name and last name is not going to really drive that many away.
Jillian Leslie 31:43
Okay, so if I’m providing value to you, you’re willing to give that up?
Adam Riemer 31:47
Jillian Leslie 32:00
Adam Riemer 32:01
A few awesome lawyers that work with bloggers that are affordable for them.
Jillian Leslie 32:05
So if people want that, will you share those names with me after?
Adam Riemer 32:09
Totally. I can do it now if you want.
Jillian Leslie 32:11
Adam Riemer 32:12
Slade Cutter is number one he’s based in Austin, Texas and his law firm is Wittliff and Cutler or Wittliff Cutter and Jaime Hawk Lieberman. She’s a fairly well known in the blogging community. She’s based out of New Jersey, and her company is Hashtag Legal.
Jillian Leslie 32:31
Adam Riemer 32:32
They both can do this stuff. They do it day in and day out.
Jillian Leslie 32:37
Got it. Now, what about this idea of,and I fall into this, I need to just email my list for them to provide value, but it’s not pointed value. You know what I mean? I’m not necessarily strategic enough. I’m like, Oh, I just need to let them know that.
Let’s say I want to talk about productivity and I want to share something that I do for productivity just to help them. Is that a valid thing? Or should I take it another level that somehow this is always going to lead to a sale?
Why You Want to Keep Your List Engaged
Adam Riemer 33:17
Well, keeping them engaged by keeping them informed or giving them new ideas, that’s keeping your audience ready so that when you’re ready to sell them a product, they’re more inclined and they trust you. It’s just building their trust in you which can build your influence over them.
Jillian Leslie 33:32
Okay, so in that respect, it’s like, Okay, good for me for doing that. Because again, I want to build that trust. If I want to help them genuinely, I want to convey that in my emails. Like this is not a gift to get. This is just I have found this new tool to help with productivity and I want to share that.
Adam Riemer 33:58
That’s essentially what you’re doing. That’s how you build trust. That’s when you really fall in love with a tool and you want to make some money from it. You can say this is why I love this and they know that you legitimately love it.
And we get nervous about disclosing relationships, especially with the links, which is ridiculous. I know for a fact when I promote an affiliate product and I suppose this is it, I get more click throughs some more engagements.
Jillian Leslie 34:22
Adam Riemer 34:23
And I have a lot of other partners that have had the same experience just like the others.
Jillian Leslie 34:26
Do you think it’s be because you seem honest?
Adam Riemer 34:29
Jillian Leslie 34:30
Okay, so in the emails, I get these emails, these sales or these trying to warm me up emails, let’s say somebody wants me to buy their course or something. And literally they are novels. It is. Let me tell you about my cat. And let me tell you about this and whatever.
And I have to say personally, I have a bias against those emails. I want direct to the point I don’t need to know your whole life story. So what is your thought about that?
Adam Riemer 35:03
It’s going to depend on the audience. I wish I had a better word for you.
Jillian Leslie 35:09
Adam Riemer 35:09
People swear it works when I look at the results I’m like, that’s not working. It’s just going to depends. Some audiences like certain messages and types, some don’t.
Jillian Leslie 35:20
Okay, so it’s really then about testing?
Adam Riemer 35:22
Yeah, I’m on the same side as you were, I hate long drawn out things I’m just like, get to the point.
Jillian Leslie 35:28
That’s what I want. I want to know how much it is.
Jillian Leslie 35:43
Okay. So there is no right answer about that.
Adam Riemer 35:47
Knowing your audience and knowing how they resonate, but also not pretending you do, because in that one case where someone sends these gigantic ones. I’m like you’re an okay rate. It’s below average. You don’t have that much engagement and nobody’s really clicking on the bottom unless there are unsubscribing.
So maybe you should try something short and direct or give them the option. Do you want this synopsis? Or do you want to click through and read the whole thing?
Should You Add Images and GIFs to emails?
Jillian Leslie 36:12
Right. And put that content someplace else? Okay, so what about adding images into your emails or adding GIF’s?
Adam Riemer 36:23
So GIF’s tend to be really heavy in weigh.
Jillian Leslie 36:26
Adam Riemer 36:27
Compress the heck out of them. Basically, what I would do is I would say, why did they sign up? And how do I keep that same feeling and thought and emotion from my site that caused them to want to give me their information? And how do I keep that consistent inside my newsletters? So that’s how I would do it.
Jillian Leslie 36:48
Again, it’s knowing your audience. It is consistency.
Adam Riemer 36:53
And then as they come back to your website, it’s a consistent branding and it’s a consistent experience. So it’s that same feeling when you keep them attached.
Jillian Leslie 37:03
Okay, well, Adam, if people want to learn more about you not necessarily reach out to you, but learn more about you. How can they do that?
Adam Riemer 37:12
Go to Adam Riemer dot me
Jillian Leslie 37:14
And can we spell that?
Adam Riemer 37:16
Absolutely. It’s A-D-A-M R-I-E-M-E-R dot me. M as in Matthew.
Jillian Leslie 37:25
Got it. Okay. And they can kind of peruse all your musings on online marketing.
Adam Riemer 37:33
Jillian Leslie 37:35
Awesome. Well, thank you so much for being on the show.
Adam Riemer 37:38
Thank you for having me. It was great meeting you.
Jillian Leslie 37:41
I hope you liked that episode with Adam. I thought it was super interesting how he thinks about slicing and dicing an email list and really finding the people in it, who are interested in buying what you’re selling.
What kinds of messaging works for different people and how to test that. It just really opened my eyes to new ways of thinking about my email list and the power of my email list.
If you are liking this show, please do me a favor, I’d be so grateful head to iTunes and give us five stars. It will help get the podcast found. It will help it grow so I can get more amazing guests on it. And share it like share it with your friends, people who you think would benefit I would be so grateful.
And I’ll see you here again next week.
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